Free Traffic Legal Advice
Live cases legal advice => Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) => Topic started by: Purple26 on November 29, 2023, 09:40:12 pm
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DNC'ed.
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Looks like Tribunal time then.
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Today is day 14 from the date of service and we have a smoking gun:
(https://i.imgur.com/GHbJsoJ.png)
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Yes the rejection is ambiguous, so you have to decide if you want to appeal based on that. It's worth waiting till Monday evening to see if it goes up before midnight, if it does then your case is quite strong (but not certain).
There's been a couple of decisions on this before, see Nayeem Haque v Transport for London (2220767288, 15 November 2022) (https://drive.google.com/uc?id=1KavlK0nNvWS2eI9ICkqjBQRg9-L-2mHc) and Mike Welch v Transport for London (2230428700, 18 November 2023) (https://drive.google.com/uc?id=1ijJW4O3zHz-LOkVRi4QHmdf983n1yyJ8).
If on Tuesday the penalty is still £80 you could appeal anyway but it would be more of a gamble.
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Do you have any mitigation available, and do you have any mitigating evidence? If so there is a strategy of last resort described here (https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/l-b-waltham-forest-50r-performing-a-prohibited-turn/msg7581/#msg7581).
The other thing with TFL PCNs is that if you make a representation within the discount period, they mess up the response as the letter won't specify whether they're reoffered the discount for 14 days from the date of the rejection, or the date of service of the rejection, so you can appeal on that as well.
They have sent a notice of rejection ( see google drive link in 1st post)They dont specify where the 14 day period starts from in page 2 paragraph 5. Im not sure if this is what you were referring to cp8759?
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Yes you're right. I have submitted a representation. Lets see what they say.
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An "appeal" is what you present at London Tribunals. What you present to TfL are "representations" (against the PCN). if you submit representations to TfL within the discount period, and they refuse, then as far as I know, they re-offer the discount. On the other hand, all appeals at London Tribunals, and, indeed, at all the other UK adjudicators are with the full PCN penalty in play, with no discount option.
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No mitigation really .Just genuine mistake so not sure what i can even put down as grounds for appeal? Also if i appeal and it gets rejected will i still have opportunity to pay at discounted rate. I called tfl on 1.12.23 to request dvd on 21.12.23.
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Do you have any mitigation available, and do you have any mitigating evidence? If so there is a strategy of last resort described here (https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/l-b-waltham-forest-50r-performing-a-prohibited-turn/msg7581/#msg7581).
The other thing with TFL PCNs is that if you make a representation within the discount period, they mess up the response as the letter won't specify whether they're reoffered the discount for 14 days from the date of the rejection, or the date of service of the rejection, so you can appeal on that as well.
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Hm, I have to say it looks like the contravention is made out, sorry to have to say it. You followed the bus closely into the box with no hesitation at all, and with a bus in front of you this was rather misguided because your view of traffic in front of it is thus blocked off. THe bus driver stops to let a bus out of a side road, but then stops for quite some time when he could move forward.
I think you're bang-to-rights, but see what the others say; there may be errors in the PCN but I'm not up-to-speed on this aspect.
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Thanks cp8759. I have uploaded the video footgae to my google drive. Our car is visible from 2.20 onwards.
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Call TFL on 0343 222 3333 and ask for the video, they will send you a DVD in the post and put the penalty on hold while you wait. In a box junction case, it is of critical importance that we see the video before giving any advice.
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Hi folks,
My wife recieved a ticket for the above. There was a lot of traffic at the time and she was behind a bus obscuring her view. By the time she relaised she was in a yellow box it was too late.
No excuse, but ive had pcns cancelled based on invalidity of pcns as advised by members from pepipoo forum.
I have posted the orginal pcn in google drive link below. Any help would be much appreciated.
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1FN9WZmTBI7SkkveJJV1v91mt07RferNG