Free Traffic Legal Advice
Live cases legal advice => Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) => Topic started by: dk007 on March 04, 2026, 09:36:36 am
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Hi, I have received Notice to keeper , I am attaching the images below:
https://cdn.imgpile.com/f/FEFGcYn_xl.jpg
https://cdn.imgpile.com/f/plyemL9_xl.jpg
https://cdn.imgpile.com/f/jHiKzVQ_xl.jpg
https://cdn.imgpile.com/f/D0a07qc_xl.jpg
https://cdn.imgpile.com/f/eMZMYuH_xl.jpg
Please could you suggest what to write in my represenatations.
Thanks
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I meant not being successful at formal representations, I know I might win at adjudication level. I was trying to understand the cost involved once I reach the adjudication stage.
and dvla address is correct so that is all good.
More often than not the discount is re-offered even after unsuccessful reps.
Why would you think you would not be successful at adjudication, their reasoning is total nonsense?
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More often than not the discount is re-offered even after unsuccessful reps.
Why would you think you would not be successful at adjudication, their reasoning is total nonsense?
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Thanks for clarifying, my main worry here is, i have the option of paying £80 now which i will not have if i decide to contest this and it will become £160. I know for sure they will reject my formal reps and it will go to LT. At that point, if i need to take help from the experts here to represent, i might have to pay for their invaluable time which if it comes to £50-£60, i might as well pay £80 now and save all this pain for me and others.
You're getting ahead of yourself. This is still the informal stage, pl see the enforcement process here:
https://www.londontribunals.gov.uk/eat/understanding-enforcement-process/parking-penalty-charge-notice-enforcement-process
As I posted earlier, they were bound to reject because they're in charge at present, they're stupid and money-hungry: what a lethal combination!
Anyway, IMO wait for the NTO and let's hope they mess up with this as well.
You are the registered keeper with current DVLA details?
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Their letter is the usual tosh we see so often. They keep referring to CPZ signs
A Permit Parking Zone cannot be part of a Controlled Parking Zone. All a CPZ does is control the restriction hours of single-yellow lines within the zone. So if this PPZ has no supporting traffic order, then PCNs for parking without a permit within it are void. The CPZ entry signs give no hint of a PPZ.
In fairness, they seem to have erected repeater signs as well as the entry signs. Frankly the only way to get a proper decision is to take them to London Tribunals, but you first would have to wait for the Notice to Owner, submit your reps again, but this time enhanced from our advice here. Once rejected again, you then can register an appeal at CC. Of course, you have to risk the full PCN penalty there.
Of course "CC" should have been typed as "LT" . I must be getting old, and I am getting old as I'll be 80 in July !! Maybe I should retire.
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You're getting ahead of yourself. This is still the informal stage, pl see the enforcement process here:
https://www.londontribunals.gov.uk/eat/understanding-enforcement-process/parking-penalty-charge-notice-enforcement-process
As I posted earlier, they were bound to reject because they're in charge at present, they're stupid and money-hungry: what a lethal combination!
Anyway, IMO wait for the NTO and let's hope they mess up with this as well.
You are the registered keeper with current DVLA details?
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Thanks for your reply on that, would someone from the experts here would be able to represent at CC and how much it might cost as I understand their time is also valuable.
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Their letter is the usual tosh we see so often. They keep referring to CPZ signs
A Permit Parking Zone cannot be part of a Controlled Parking Zone. All a CPZ does is control the restriction hours of single-yellow lines within the zone. So if this PPZ has no supporting traffic order, then PCNs for parking without a permit within it are void. The CPZ entry signs give no hint of a PPZ.
In fairness, they seem to have erected repeater signs as well as the entry signs. Frankly the only way to get a proper decision is to take them to London Tribunals, but you first would have to wait for the Notice to Owner, submit your reps again, but this time enhanced from our advice here. Once rejected again, you then can register an appeal at CC. Of course, you have to risk the full PCN penalty there.
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Hello Experts,
I was wondering if anyone had a chance to look at it yet?
Thanks
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Hi,
They have rejected my representation, pleas find the details attached below:
https://cdn.imgpile.com/f/govf1Or_xl.jpg
https://cdn.imgpile.com/f/tecHDeR_xl.jpg
Please could you advise of next steps, are they any chances of fighting it out or should i just pay this?
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It says the notice served but not the contravention occurred.
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No. Have you read your PCN, IMO the wording is as required i.e. 'within the period of 28/14 days beginning with the date on which the contravention occurred/PCN was served'.
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Thanks for sharing the representation details. From my previous conversation on one of the other PCN, someone in this forum had previously advised some discrepancy on the PCN wording that made them win the case.
Schedule 2 Para 2 (d) The Civil Enforcement of Road Traffic Contraventions (Approved Devices, Charging Guidelines and General Provisions) (England) Regulations 2022 provides that a PCN issued under Regulation 9 must state "that the penalty charge must be paid within the period of 28 days beginning with the date on which the alleged contravention occurred". The PCN in the present case states that it must be paid within 28 days of the date on which this Penalty Charge Notice was served. Although the two dates will of course often be the same, as the PCN in this case does not state what it is required to state it too is non compliant and no penalty could be demanded on the basis of it.
Do you think, i can mention this as well now?
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They'll reject your informal reps anyway, so I'd simply stick with the facts and see what mess they get themselves into.
Possibly along these lines:
On **** I parked in Amhurst Gardens on an unmarked length of carriageway, as shown in your photos, which indicates that there are no parking restrictions imposed under a local order. I returned to my car to find a PCN alleging a contravention in respect of a parking place. I looked around and could see a parking place sign but this had no effect because the mandatory road markings to indicate the extent of the restriction were not present. Subsequent to these events, I explored the area further and found Controlled Parking Zone entrance signs, but as these do not relate to parking restrictions I therefore dismissed them.
I am therefore making representations on the grounds that the contravention did not occur.
If the authority reject these representations they must prove in detail by reference to the relevant regulations why parking on an unmarked length of carriageway could give rise to the alleged contravention.
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Thanks for looking at them. what do you advise me to do, should i make representation and what to write in it?
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So it's a PPA. It's a bit strange having one starting part way on a road that also has a CPZ.
It looks to be well signed with entry signs on both sides and repeater signs.
The only thing I can see to question is the order establishing it as it doesn't appear on their order map.
(https://i.ibb.co/WW1QCk2H/image.png)
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I visited the area over the weekend, these are the pictures from both ends of Amhurst Gardens and some from the middle of the road.
https://cdn.imgpile.com/f/mynNte4_xl.jpeg
https://cdn.imgpile.com/f/r4tjpow_xl.jpeg
https://cdn.imgpile.com/f/E3KaX4Y_xl.jpeg
https://cdn.imgpile.com/f/Njt8Fcc_xl.jpeg
https://cdn.imgpile.com/f/bEF75Ih_xl.jpeg
Please let me know if this is sufficient or any other details would be needed.
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Look for CPZ signs - (I have posted the boundaries they have on their map above):
(https://i.ibb.co/WN4q6rVN/Screenshot-2026-03-06-at-18-20-48.png)
(https://i.ibb.co/JWdW7yq4/Screenshot-2026-03-06-at-18-21-30.png)
And/or permit parking area signs:
(https://i.ibb.co/nMdvxz6b/Screenshot-2026-03-06-at-18-22-49.png)
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Thanks you all for the replies. I would visit the road over the weekend and post it here, what exactly i should look for please?
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There are a number of small CPZs there or what they call CPZs - if they are CPZs there is no contravention as CPZs can't have unrestricted kerbs.
We need to see zone signage in the area.
(https://i.ibb.co/qY6p0cQS/Screenshot-2026-03-04-at-22-07-55.png)
(https://i.ibb.co/jkL6npb0/Screenshot-2026-03-04-at-22-08-17.png)
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Where are the markings?
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There's nothing about a PPA on the map or in the latest notice of order, which refers to a CPZ - I can't find the actual order.
Resident permit parking is indicated along both sides of most of the road.
(https://i.ibb.co/0Rwch6ZX/Screenshot-2026-03-04-at-12-15-34.png)
(https://i.ibb.co/RTwQ498S/Screenshot-2026-03-04-at-16-36-15.png)
(https://i.ibb.co/0p1tn7NR/Screenshot-2026-03-04-at-16-31-38.png)
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There aren't any road markings in the council's photos therefore either this is a monumental c**k-up by them or they consider that you were parked in a Permit Parking Area(not a controlled zone, but a PPA).
But there aren't any photos of a PPA sign either!
IMO, evidentially their photos are b******s, but this won't necessarily stop them at this stage!
Are you able to return to see whether PPA signs are present - see this link to their form and use: https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/5c78f895e5274a0ebfec719b/traffic-signs-manual-chapter-03.pdf
para. 13.10.
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Street view shows only the South end of Amhurst gardens is in a Controlled Parking Zone, but the Hounslow map shows that the rest of road is now also in a (different) parking zone. So you should have passed a sign as you drove in highlighting the change in Zone. Are you able to go back and have a look / take pictures?
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Hello Experts,
I have received this pcn, there were no yellow lines and i was not blocking any driveway, not sure, why did I get this PCN. Please could someone help.
Thanks
https://cdn.imgpile.com/f/WegT7wh_xl.jpeg
https://cdn.imgpile.com/f/tljIP4J_xl.jpeg