Author Topic: Redbridge PCN for incorrect Ringo location by one digit  (Read 2879 times)

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Re: Redbridge PCN for incorrect Ringo location by one digit
« Reply #15 on: »
Hi all,

They sent the Notice of Rejection just before Xmas, dated 22/12/24. They rejected the rep despite the letter:

-acknowledging that it was a genuine mistake and no financial loss occurred
 
-acknowledging that the car was indeed parked for less than an hour (within the one hour free parking)

-acknowledging "payment was made" for a session, albeit in a different location (NB no payment was made, it was a Ringo booking for a one hour free parking).

Additionally, the letter responds to my request for discretion by saying:

"Regarding your request for discretion, enforcement authoritles are required to act fairly and proportionately. While we appreciate that this was a genuine mistake and that no financial loss occurred to the Council, the contravention is enforceable under the Traffic Management Act 2004. After reviewing the circumstances, we are satisfied that the contravention occurred....and remains payable"

Please can you advise what to do next?

Here is a link to the full NoR letter:

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Re: Redbridge PCN for incorrect Ringo location by one digit
« Reply #16 on: »
I would take them to London Tribunals; their letter of rejection is a disgrace and shows their venality and rapacity in neon lights !  OK, you've got to risk the full penalty, but appeals have been won in the aspect of how can one pay for a free parking period.

Re: Redbridge PCN for incorrect Ringo location by one digit
« Reply #17 on: »
They say the use of 7 digit codes is standard practice - well it isn't. They are mostly 5 digit in my view.

The problem with the rejection of acting fairly is the tribunal can't act fairly and will probably record that the council chose not to use discretion and is entitled to enforce. But we need to see this tested properly as it is statutory guidance.

But I would have a go as if you get the right adjudicator the ground of not paying for a free thing is sometimes allowed, and you could also get a recommendation to cancel even if appeal refused.

They also say the code rendered the session invalid - but this is not the contravention on the PCN.

Re: Redbridge PCN for incorrect Ringo location by one digit
« Reply #18 on: »
I agree. It's a disgraceful letter from the Council. I'm happy to take it to tribunal if anyone here is able to help with the appeal?

Re: Redbridge PCN for incorrect Ringo location by one digit
« Reply #19 on: »
I'll help.

This case from yesterday references the statutory guidance. It concern a removal but the principle is there.

------------

Case reference   2250395772
Appellant   xxxxxx
Authority   London Borough of Newham
VRM   CN64OFT
   
PCN Details
PCN   PN22739440
Contravention date   06 Jun 2025
Contravention time   10:45:00
Contravention location   Jedburgh Road
Penalty amount   GBP 160.00
Contravention   Parked resident/shared use without a valid permit
   
Referral date   -
   
Decision Date   12 Jan 2026
Adjudicator   Edward Houghton
Appeal decision   Appeal allowed
Direction   refund the release charges paid.
Reasons   The Appellant’s case is essentially that the resident was unable to purchase a permit I until 12 51 as a result of a poorly performing computer system.
On parking a vehicle in any type of bay the motorist is allowed a reasonable time to f do whatever is necessary to validate the parking, in this case to obtain a permit. In these days of virtual permits it seems to me one should take a fairly generous view of what is a reasonable time in cases where the motorist is experiencing IT difficulties of some kind. However the point has eventually to be reached after a few minutes where the motorist has to accept that the attempt to obtain a permit has failed , and move the vehicle elsewhere, inconvenient and irritating though that would obviously be.
I see no reason at all to doubt the evidence in this case as to the difficulties experienced with computer system. However as the Appellant is unable to state the time the vehicle was initially parked It is impossible to make say how long the vehicle had been parked, attempting to obtain a permit , prior to the issue of the PCN. It sounds as if it might well have been some considerable time and I am not satisfied that this is a case of a PCN being issued to a vehicle prematurely within the few minutes allowable for permit to be obtained. The vehicle was therefore in contravention and it cannot be said the PCN was issued anything other than lawfully. The circumstances of course amount to mitigation, but as an Adjudicator I have no power in law to allow appeals on the basis of mitigation, the exercise of discretion on that basis being a matter for the Council, not an Adjudicator.
The vehicle was , however , subsequently removed. The Appellant contends this was unnecessary ; and there seems to be no obvious reason for it. I therefore adjourned the case for the Council to “ to demonstrate that in removing the vehicle it has complied with its statutory duty to have regard to the guidance of the Secretary of State.”. The Council, in its response has re-stated my request as “The Adjudicator has directed that the Enforcement Authority to provide details of the removal” which is not what I directed ; and the Council’s response in this form rather suggests that it is completely unaware of the Guidance and its statutory duty to comply with it , let alone having any evidence that it has done so. As I am unable to be satisfied the Council has complied with its statutory duty I am not satisfied that the removal of the vehicle was lawful.
The Appeal is therefore allowed to the extent of requiring the Council to refund the release fees (only ) leaving the Appellant to bear the cost of the PCN as a more proportionate penalty for the contravention

Re: Redbridge PCN for incorrect Ringo location by one digit
« Reply #20 on: »
Thank you mate. Please let me know what to do.

Re: Redbridge PCN for incorrect Ringo location by one digit
« Reply #21 on: »
Well, first, if you're going to take them to London Tribunals, is to register an appeal with them, and in the reps box, you put "I rely on my formal representations". This can be added-to later before the hearing. Do NOT opt for a papers-only adjudication as we see these lose more often than not. Hearings are by phone or video.

Re: Redbridge PCN for incorrect Ringo location by one digit
« Reply #22 on: »
Hi all, really sorry but I forgot to update you all that they scheduled a hearing for Thursday 9th of July, 16:30

Via online Teams

Is anyone able to help anymore? Or is it too short of a notice now?


Re: Redbridge PCN for incorrect Ringo location by one digit
« Reply #23 on: »
Hi all,

I attended this on behalf of my wife. It was online and the adjudicator was late by 45 minutes.

Despite the adjudicator seeming to understand and acknowledge the central arguments I made (which were provided in writing as well ahead of the hearing), he has refused the appeal and didn't even address the central arguments, instead focusing on the keying error.

The central arguments were that the contravention of "parked without payment of the parking charge" did not and could not have occurred as no payment was due. It was a free session and Council acknowledged that the car did not stay behind beyond this free period. We also submitted that the Council did not address the points repeatedly made around acting fairly and proportionately as per statutory guidance. This too was ignored by the Adjudicator in his written decision.

Here is what he has said in the written judgement thta has been emailed to us:

"I can fully accept that the appellant did not seek to avoid payment. I have however disagreed with her arguments that the Council has been at fault in pursuing the penalty charge under appeal.

"The appellant failed to pay the charge which was an alternative to registering correctly for the hour which was gratis provided registration was done correctly.

"Errors with long numbers have a long history and the forbears of young motorists will remember how
misdials were common and indeed frequent in the days when telephones were ones with rotary dials. In
more modern days I know one time passwords also get miskeyed frequently and that too is irritating. I do not however see the length of the bay locator number as opearting as legal defence in this case.

"Unfortunately for motorists making keyboard mistakes the Councils have strong legal ground for insisting on
a penalty charge when the there is a motorist keyboard error. The line of authority for this in this tribunal
derives from Lady Walmsley’s Case where the Court of Appeal held that it was not payment that was crucial
but payment for the correct registration. By analogy I accept that the motorist has responsibility if
registering for doing so with the correct bay locator.

"I do not identify the error in this case as explained by weighty mitigation and I do not consider the Council
has wrongly failed to assess whether the case warranted discretionary cancellation. The penalty charge
claimed is the lawful amount. The amount has been correctly set and lawfully approved in London. It
lawfully has the character of a standard amount and it is not legally disproportionate.

"Gerald Styles
Adjudicator
10th July 2026"

Re: Redbridge PCN for incorrect Ringo location by one digit
« Reply #24 on: »
Full decision. Must say Adjudicator Styles sounds early 20th century wiith his dial phone reference. Misdialling a telephone number doesn't (usually) cost you £110.

I still think the 7 digit codes cross into territory where statutory guidance on fairness should come into play.

Plus of course there is the nonsense of not paying for a free thing.

But it looks like we'll have to accept that unless you get one of the few friendly adjudicators there is no defence to Redbridge pushing these through.

I would add though that we can push for a non-binding recommendation to cancel, and that the TMO provided to the tribunal stands up in court.

-----------


Case reference   2260030725
Appellant   xxxxxxx
Authority   London Borough of Redbridge
VRM   FT12UGR
   
PCN Details
PCN   AF11197984
Contravention date   12 Sep 2025
Contravention time   15:08:00
Contravention location   Mildmay Road
Penalty amount   GBP 110.00
Contravention   Parked without payment of the parking charge
   
Referral date   -
   
Decision Date   10 Jul 2026
Adjudicator   Gerald Styles
Appeal decision   Appeal refused
Direction   Full penalty charge notice amount stated to be paid within 28 days.
Reasons   The appellant did not attend the on-line hearing arranged for 9 July. The Council was not expected to attend and did not do so.
Her case to tribunal was set out at length and can be conceniently recorded in full below. It was presented at the hearing by her husband Mr xxxxx.
I am submitting these final representations ahead of my hearing.
I formally contest that the alleged contravention of "not paying
a parking charge" did not occur. My vehicle was parked for less
than one hour, during which time a free, one-hour parking session
was available and active. Consequently, as the parking period was
free of charge, the allegation of failing to pay is a factual
impossibility. Furthermore, even if a technical contravention
occurred, I submit that it was the result of a genuine, minor
keying error, and the Council has failed to act in accordance
with its statutory duty to exercise fairness and proportionality.
1. Failure to Address Statutory Duty of Fairness
I am deeply disappointed that in both my initial challenge and my
formal representation, I explicitly requested that the Council
address its statutory duty to act fairly and with discretion. The
Council’s rejection letters failed to address this requirement
entirely. The Council’s response demonstrates an apparent lack of
awareness regarding this statutory guidance, let alone evidence
that it has been applied.
2. Contradiction of the Alleged Contravention
The Council has formally acknowledged in its Notice of Rejection
that my vehicle was parked for less than one hour. As the parking
session was free for the first hour, the contravention of "not
paying a parking charge" is a factual impossibility. I left the
space before the free session ended; therefore, no payment was
required, and no loss was suffered by the Council.
3. Mischaracterisation of "Standard Practice"
The Council asserts that the use of 7-digit location codes is
"standard practice". I dispute this; 7-digit codes are not the
industry standard, and their use inherently increases the risk of
minor human error. Furthermore, the Council argues that the
incorrect code rendered the session "invalid," yet this is not
the contravention stated on the PCN, which specifically alleges
"not paying a parking charge".
.4,Proportionality and Evidence of Intent
I have provided a RingGo receipt confirming a session was booked
for the relevant time, along with a Monzo bank statement showing
a purchase made at the Ilford Exchange during that same period.
These documents objectively prove my presence at the location and
my clear intention to comply with parking requirements. In light
of the fact that no payment was required, the enforcement of a
penalty charge is an excessive and disproportionate response to a
minor, honest administrative error.
Conclusion
I respectfully request that the Adjudicator considers that the
Council has failed to demonstrate it has complied with its
statutory duty to act fairly. I ask that this appeal be allowed,
or, at a minimum, that a recommendation be made for the Council
to cancel the PCN given the absence of any financial loss or intent to evade charges.
…..
I can fully accept that the appellant did not seek to avoid payment. I have however disagreed with her arguments that the Council has been at fault in pursuing the penalty charge under appeal.
The appellant failed to pay the charge which was an alternative to registering correctly for the hour which was gratis provided registration was done correctly.
Errors with long numbers have a long history and the forbears of young motorists will remember how misdials were common and indeed frequent in the days when telephones were ones with rotary dials. In more modern days I know one time passwords also get miskeyed frequently and that too is irritating. I do not however see the length of the bay locator number as opearting as legal defence in this case.
Unfortunately for motorists making keyboard mistakes the Councils have strong legal ground for insisting on a penalty charge when the there is a motorist keyboard error. The line of authority for this in this tribunal derives from Lady Walmsley’s Case where the Court of Appeal held that it was not payment that was crucial but payment for the correct registration. By analogy I accept that the motorist has responsibility if registering for doing so with the correct bay locator.
I do not identify the error in this case as explained by weighty mitigation and I do not consider the Council has wrongly failed to assess whether the case warranted discretionary cancellation. The penalty charge claimed is the lawful amount. The amount has been correctly set and lawfully approved in London. It lawfully has the character of a standard amount and it is not legally disproportionate.

Re: Redbridge PCN for incorrect Ringo location by one digit
« Reply #25 on: »
Effing bar stewards  :-X

I'm facing exactly the same for my representation.

So it looks like lucky dip with the adjudicator you get, No change there then.