3. PCN Code 622- Parking on footpath
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PCN Code 622- Parking on footpath
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Hi all,

I've recently received a PCN for an code 622 in Havering and was seeking advise if there is possibility of an appeal as is for 1 min. (18:23 to 18:23)

I wanted to park the car on the road and went into the restaurant to ask if I can park in front of their door, my son was still sitting in the car and in the mean time the enforcement officer came in and started preparing the ticket. I told him that I am looking to park however he wouldn't listen , I just got in the car and parked where I wanted to as opposed to driving away as stated in the ticket and received the council ticket over post.

I have moved address since the date of the contravention and dates are as follows.

1. Date of Contravention - 16/09/2022
2. Date I moved 20/10/2022 - Still have access to old property until 25-Jan-2023
3. As per council Notice of rejection was sent on 28 November 2022.
4. Date on V5 for change of address 29-Nov-2022.
5. Charge certificate received at original address ~10-Jan which I have a copy as had access to the old address and it was empty.

I have now received the order of recovery on 8-Sep-2023.

CAR Reg: HN61 LAE
PCN number is HG81262837

I will post the original appeal and pictures on a different post.
« Last Edit: September 12, 2023, 09:14:30 am by londondriver11 »
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Re: PCN Code 622- Parking on footpath
« Reply #1 on: »
you need to post the PCN both sides,get and post all council photos and also post a GSV of the location
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Re: PCN Code 622- Parking on footpath
« Reply #2 on: »

I have now received the order of recovery on 8-Sep-2023.




Is is addressed to you at your current DVLA address or to you at your old address to which you only had access until 25 Jan. 2023?

If your new address, how was this obtained by the council?

On the basis of your timeline, the PCN/NTO, CC and OfR addresses must be the same unless you(the addressee on the NTO) have notified the council to the contrary.

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Re: PCN Code 622- Parking on footpath
« Reply #3 on: »
https://ibb.co/dKpdh2n
https://ibb.co/KqZyPkt
https://ibb.co/GcZJRvz
https://ibb.co/Sf67Gp2
https://ibb.co/Vv0tqK5
https://ibb.co/5jBpTmC

Location : https://goo.gl/maps/hD4cLTxXTXaVPvJn8

Dear Sir/Madam,

Subject PCN HG81262837, Car Reg HN61LAE
I was visiting the restaurant Delhi live on Victoria road on Friday 16/09/2022 and received the above PCN.I wished to park outside the restaurant Delhi Live and the limited parking would have partially blocked the restaurant's entrance. I parked the car in-front of the restaurant with my son still sitting inside the car and went inside the restaurant to ask if it was ok to park the car in front of their door. In the mean time the enforcement officer came and started preparing the ticket, I came out and told him that I am looking to park at the same place however he wouldn't listen and suggested that I should pay now or it would be a full fine later via post.
I then sat in the car and parked in the space outside the restaurant as opposed to being driven away which is being suggested in the PCN, please see picture attached with time of 2 mins past the time marked in the PCN.
Additionally the PCN fails to inform me of my correct legal position, in that it misstates the period in which I may pay the penalty. It says >
"The penalty charge must be paid not later then the last day of the period of 28 days beginning with the date of this penalty charge notice"
The correct period is defined by S.I. 2022/71 Sch 2 para 3 as >
(d)that the penalty charge must be paid within the period of 28 days beginning with the date on which the penalty charge notice is served,
The PCN is further flawed where it refers to payment of the discounted amount.
It states >
"If the penalty charge is paid not later than the period of 21 days beginning with the date of this notice the penalty charge will be reduced by 50%"
The correct period in law is stated as >
In Sch 2 para 3
(e)that if the penalty charge is paid no later than the applicable date, the penalty charge will be reduced by the amount of any applicable discount,
The applicable date is defined in section 2 of the main body of the act as >
(b)in the case of any other notice, the last day of the period of 14 days beginning with the date on which the notice is served;

Considering the circumstances and that the PCN contains such gross errors it is invalid and cannot be enforced. I request you to cancel the PCN at the earliest.

Regards
« Last Edit: September 13, 2023, 12:08:49 am by cp8759 »
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Re: PCN Code 622- Parking on footpath
« Reply #4 on: »
"Is is addressed to you at your current DVLA address or to you at your old address to which you only had access until 25 Jan. 2023?

If your new address, how was this obtained by the council?

On the basis of your timeline, the PCN/NTO, CC and OfR addresses must be the same unless you(the addressee on the NTO) have notified the council to the contrary."


- As per the previous thread on pepipoo I had contacted the council to ask about the status of the representation and at that time itself communicated them the updated address.
« Last Edit: September 12, 2023, 12:12:19 pm by londondriver11 »
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Re: PCN Code 622- Parking on footpath
« Reply #5 on: »
At this stage all you need to do is file a witness statement with TEC on the ground that you made a representation and did not receive a response, you can email it to them, their address is tec@justice.gov.uk (put the PCN number in the subject line).

If you want to fill in the form electronically you can download form TE9 here (they will accept a typed signature).

I also suggest you re-post the PCN and the charge certificate on here.
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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
Re: PCN Code 622- Parking on footpath
« Reply #6 on: »
If you submit a WS this would be accepted by TEC.

But not necessarily by the adjudicator(to whom the authority must refer the matter) who if prompted by the authority may direct you to explain the circumstances surrounding why you did not receive the NOR.

Date I moved 20/10/2022 - Still have access to old property until 25-Jan-2023
3. As per council Notice of rejection was sent on 28 November 2022.


IMO, the NOR would be presumed delivered and as you had access to the property at the time then you received it. 

You posted: As per the previous thread on pepipoo I had contacted the council to ask about the status of the representation and at that time itself communicated them the updated address.

So, when did you tell them (date) and how (method) and your evidence pl.

Pl don't fudge the issue of receiving. If you only visited the property infrequently and did find the NOR, albeit after the 28-day period had expired then we should know, it's not the end of the world.
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Re: PCN Code 622- Parking on footpath
« Reply #7 on: »
Hi,

I was visting the property weekly as it was empty and we were still moving and as mentioned I did receive the charge certificate but never received the NOR. I contacted the council on 10th Jan after I had received the charge certificate to ask about the status of the appeal as assumed they might have missed it, only then did I get an electronic copy of the letter that they said had been sent out. As per suggestion from the group I provided them the V5 to update the address.

If you think that there isn't much we can progress with here then please let me know and I will pay the fine, I was hoping that considering that I had not received the NOR then would be allowed to pay the reduced fine of 60£.

I'll scan and upload the pcn and charge certificate tonight.

Thanks
Puneet
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Re: PCN Code 622- Parking on footpath
« Reply #8 on: »
Based on your last narrative about collecting mail every week, submission of a WS to TEC would be in order. Essentially, the NOR did not arrive at the unoccupied old address to which you had access, yet the CC did.
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Re: PCN Code 622- Parking on footpath
« Reply #9 on: »

+1.
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Re: PCN Code 622- Parking on footpath
« Reply #10 on: »
Thanks all. I have now emailed the scanned copy of the witness statement to tec@justice.gov.uk

PCN:
https://ibb.co/KqZyPkt

Charge Certificate
https://ibb.co/hyR3KsP
https://ibb.co/0KkrNHc
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Re: PCN Code 622- Parking on footpath
« Reply #11 on: »
Hi,

I have received a letter which says thatthe order for recovery of unpaid penalty charge be revoked and that the charge certificate be cancelled.

What happens next ?  Do I receive another one to pay the reduced 60£ fine.

Thanks
Puneet
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Re: PCN Code 622- Parking on footpath
« Reply #12 on: »

What happens next ?  Do I receive another one to pay the reduced 60£ fine.

It depends...on what the NOR stated.

In your circumstances(made reps in time but NOR not received) the regs require the authority to refer the matter to the adjudicator who may issue directions.In London the routine seems to be that the authority would first reissue the NOR giving you the opportunity to pay the discount if re-offered or for you to submit an appeal(cuts down on routine for the adjudicators).

But until you hear from the adjudicator or the authority there's nothing for you to do (other than keep a watching brief and come back here is 10 days or so ifyou've not heard anything) EXCEPT IMO notify the authority AND the adjudicator(and get confirmation) of your address for correspondence, there is no need to keep visiting your previous address.   
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Re: PCN Code 622- Parking on footpath
« Reply #13 on: »
What's the penalty amount on the council webstie?
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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
Re: PCN Code 622- Parking on footpath
« Reply #14 on: »
Thanks for the replies. I did check Havering website and it doesn't seem to show the outstanding amount. It just has a box to put in an amount myself and pay so will wait for further correspondence.
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  3. PCN Code 622- Parking on footpath