Author Topic: Parking Ticket With Suspended Sign Showing  (Read 1180 times)

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Parking Ticket With Suspended Sign Showing
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A PCN was put on car for a permit only zone which has the following sign showing as suspended parking.

It says for up to one week but it is still present, should it not have been taken down, is that a grounds for appeal?

https://ibb.co/RDp6rwq

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Re: Parking Ticket With Suspended Sign Showing
« Reply #1 on: »
Please post both sides of the unredacted PCN and a GSV link to the location.
Here is the sign.


Re: Parking Ticket With Suspended Sign Showing
« Reply #2 on: »
Can we see the PCN, any council photos and a streetview link pls.

That suspension sign has no force in law, it is purely advisory.

It's irrelevant anyway, had parking been suspended you still could not park in a permit bay with or without permit

Re: Parking Ticket With Suspended Sign Showing
« Reply #3 on: »

Re: Parking Ticket With Suspended Sign Showing
« Reply #4 on: »
Here's the front of the PCN, p[lease add the back.

Re: Parking Ticket With Suspended Sign Showing
« Reply #5 on: »
Sorry John

Please see the back

https://ibb.co/bRBMdGJ

Re: Parking Ticket With Suspended Sign Showing
« Reply #6 on: »
there you go

Re: Parking Ticket With Suspended Sign Showing
« Reply #7 on: »
Here are the council photos:















Let's start with the basics, why was the car parked there without a permit?
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order

Re: Parking Ticket With Suspended Sign Showing
« Reply #8 on: »
Looking at GSV here https://maps.app.goo.gl/bXWE8uXLpkRC21qFA I note your car was parked at the far northeastern end of the bay, and there only seems to be a single sign some 40 yards away here https://maps.app.goo.gl/E7PVEuNMRhTipgTD7

Did you actually see the sign when you parked?
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order

Re: Parking Ticket With Suspended Sign Showing
« Reply #9 on: »
Believed it was a 2 hour zone to park rather than just permit, I didn't see the sign until after I drove off (which i when i took the picture) as the sign is further down the road
« Last Edit: October 29, 2023, 09:07:11 pm by cp8759 »

Re: Parking Ticket With Suspended Sign Showing
« Reply #10 on: »
Please don't bloat-quote as it makes the thread unnecessarily long.

I think the distance from your car to the sign is the strongest point but I just need to clear up one thing: you parked, got out, didn't see any signs, why would you believe it's a 2 hour zone?
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order

Re: Parking Ticket With Suspended Sign Showing
« Reply #11 on: »
Please don't bloat-quote as it makes the thread unnecessarily long.

I think the distance from your car to the sign is the strongest point but I just need to clear up one thing: you parked, got out, didn't see any signs, why would you believe it's a 2 hour zone?

That is correct, if you look at it  from google maps, i got out and walked to the main road behind the car thus not seeing any signs.

I thought it was a 2 hour zone as the adjacent road has that option on the left (newport road)

Re: Parking Ticket With Suspended Sign Showing
« Reply #12 on: »
Should I put forward an appeal based on the distance from the location of the sign?

Re: Parking Ticket With Suspended Sign Showing
« Reply #13 on: »
Here you go:

Dear Reading Borough Council,

I challenge liability for PCN RG26788093 on the ground that the alleged contravention did not occur. When I parked my car I got out and did not see any signs, I had noticed a 2 hour restriction in an adjacent road so I assumed the restriction would be the same.

Only after getting the PCN I found a sign some 40 yards away, which was not visible from where I parked my car. To illustrate the point, my car was parked where you can see the first car on the left at LINK and as you can see, no signage is visible.

Chapter 3 of the traffic signs manual specifies at 13.21.3 that "As bay markings denote a place where a driver might be able to park, information about the permitted parking is required at more frequent intervals, particularly where the bay marking does not have any legend to indicate the type of user. All signs should be within the extent of the bay and the first sign should generally be no more than 15 m from the end of the bay. Where the length of the bay is less than 30 m, a sign mounted at the mid‑point should therefore be sufficient".

In this case the bay is well over 30 metres and from where I was parked, the sign was simply out of sight and not visible, it follows that the signage was not adequate within the meaning of regulation 18 of the The Local Authorities' Traffic Orders (Procedure) (England and Wales) Regulations 1996.

In light of the above the alleged contravention did not occur and the PCN must be cancelled.

Yours faithfully,

I will PM you a link to put in the representation, it will redirect to imgur.com/SLgMguT but if you give them the link I'll PM you, we can use the click count to confirm whether they've looked at it or not (obviously do not click on that link yourself as we want the click count to remain at zero). If they don't click on it, we can then prove they've failed to consider all of the evidence. If they say in the rejection that they've considered all the evidence, we've got them for lying as well.

Send the representation via the council website (do not send a letter in the post), and keep a screenshot of the confirmation page.
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order

Re: Parking Ticket With Suspended Sign Showing
« Reply #14 on: »
I have now received the following response from the council rejecting the claim

https://ibb.co/KyL4nMs