Author Topic: NEWHAM Council - 34J Being in a bus lane - 36 seconds before restrictions are lifted  (Read 97 times)

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tlogic

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Hi

This is PCN nr two I'm fighting lol. 

I recently received a PCN from Newham Council for driving in a bus lane.

Restrictions on Barking Road, are from 7am til 10am and again 4pm til 7pm.

I was snapped driving in the bus lane at 18:59:24,  - which work out to be 36 seconds before the restrictions are lifted. It's either my car or their camera  not calibrated, could I Successfully appeal?

Thanks

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Incandescent

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No doubt you're an escapee from Pepipoo going phut !

There are previous adjudications on this which support your case based on the fact that it is unreasonable to expect a clock in a car to have this degree of precision on times. This is a money-grubbing PCN, issued because they know most people just cough-up. However the reality is that to get the PCN cancelled, it is very likely you will have to take them to London Tribunals. ALthough the full PCN penalty would be in play, I can't see you losing, although it has to be said some adjudicators are complete pedants. See what others say, but don't miss the deadline for submitting representations,
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cp8759

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I was snapped driving in the bus lane at 18:59:24,  - which work out to be 36 seconds before the restrictions are lifted. It's either my car or their camera  not calibrated, could I Successfully appeal?
Undoubtedly, and for more reasons than you think. Please post up the PCN, bus lane PCNs are generally really easy to beat.
I am not on the "motorists's side", nor am I on the "police/CPS/council's" side, I am simply in favour of the rule of law. Section 6 of the Interpretation Act 1978 applies to everything I post as it would apply to an Act of Parliament. I am a Conservative councillor, this means some people think I am "scum". I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor nor a barrister.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order

Hippocrates

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Two PCNs? We need to see them as advised above.
There are known knowns which, had we known, we would never have wished to know. It is known that this also applies to the known unknowns. However, when one attends a hearing, Mr Rumsfeld's idea that there are also unknown unknowns fails to apply because, anyone who is in the know, knows that unknown unknowns are purely a deception otherwise known as an aleatory experience or also known as a lottery. I know that I know this to be a fact and, in this knowledge, I know that I am fully prepared to present my case but, paradoxically, in full knowledge that the unknown unknowns may well apply in view of some adjudicators' lack of knowing what they ought to know through no fault of their own.

"Hippocrates"
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cp8759

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@tlogic are you still with us?
I am not on the "motorists's side", nor am I on the "police/CPS/council's" side, I am simply in favour of the rule of law. Section 6 of the Interpretation Act 1978 applies to everything I post as it would apply to an Act of Parliament. I am a Conservative councillor, this means some people think I am "scum". I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor nor a barrister.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
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tlogic

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Hi CP879,

Apologies, I'm still here  :)

copy of pcn below.

I've  already submitted an appeal which I am waiting to hear back from.

Below is a copy of my appeal:

=======

I am appealing this PCN on the grounds that the contravention did not occur.
I am fully aware of the restrictions on this bus lane, and entered it immediately after 7pm, which is when the restriction ends. I notice your one of your online still photographs of my car in the bus lane/stop states the time of 18.59.23, some 37 seconds before 7pm. 

Two devices in my car, my dashboard clock and my mobile phone on a mount, both showed the time as 7pm, neither show the exact second, so as far as I was concerned the time was 7pm. I would not have entered the bus lane otherwise.

I would suggest that a contravention that occurs 37 seconds from the end of the restriction is effectively de-minimis and for that reason, no contravention occurred and the PCN should be cancelled.

====




cp8759

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@tlogic let us know when you get a reply. This will likely have to be taken to the tribunal.
I am not on the "motorists's side", nor am I on the "police/CPS/council's" side, I am simply in favour of the rule of law. Section 6 of the Interpretation Act 1978 applies to everything I post as it would apply to an Act of Parliament. I am a Conservative councillor, this means some people think I am "scum". I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor nor a barrister.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
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tlogic

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@tlogic let us know when you get a reply. This will likely have to be taken to the tribunal.

thanks CP8759, I will keep this thread updated.