3. Medway Code 01 - Parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours
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JOJO1209

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Medway Code 01 - Parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours
« on: November 10, 2024, 06:46:03 am »
Sorry for the late posting.
I was stressed out and found it difficult to deal with this 
Please are there any grounds for  a successful appeal / challenge.
If the chances of a successful appeal / challenge is unlikely, I will ideally like to pay it within the discounted period of 14 days i.e. 10th / 11th November. It is still showing as £35 on the website.
Many thanks in advance for your time and input.


1.  There were no visible parking restrictions seen or evidenced on the PCN Photo within reasonable distance from when I was parked. The parking restriction template was not evidenced in the  PCN photos uploaded unto the council website.


2. My car was waiting to be loaded with several  items from the Cash and Carry shop across the road.
 

3. I have also looked at the photo evidence uploaded by the CEO onto the council website, I cannot see any pictures of signage or parking restrictions showing the restricted hours included in the photo evidence on Medway's website. I didn’t see any parking restrictions nearby. See Attached.


 It was late Sunday afternoon. I went to the Cash and Carry shop (London Cash and Carry on 291 -293 Chatham High Street ME4 4BN) across the road from where I was parked to by a number of heavy / bulky items for our annual international women conference 14th – 17th November 2024.  I have the flyer for the conference as evidence. Items included 6 bags of 20 kg special type of rice and 5 bags of 10kg Ground rice. I had to park as close as possible to the shop for easy access because of the weight, bulkiness and the number of items to be purchased and load into my car. 
We have previously purchased these items from them that store. None was available on the shop floor. The shop assistant had to go into their stock room to check if they had any at the back.
They didn’t have any in stock but they can order it in for me. This process took a while about 5-6 mins. Came back to my car to find a PCN.


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John U.K.

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Re: Medway Code 01 - Parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours
« Reply #1 on: November 10, 2024, 07:48:10 am »
Well it looks like a pedestrian area, but there are plenty of cars about.

Please post a GSV link to the location.

The items you collected seems to fit the loading criteria - have you itemised invoices?
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H C Andersen

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Re: Medway Code 01 - Parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours
« Reply #2 on: November 10, 2024, 12:21:21 pm »
PCN served 27 Oct.
14-day statutory discount period ended 9 Nov, yesterday.

By your account you were shopping and therefore on the face of it a loading exemption would not apply.

What was your route to this location i.e. where did you pass the signs which created the restriction?

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JOJO1209

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Re: Medway Code 01 - Parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours
« Reply #3 on: November 10, 2024, 05:33:34 pm »
Quote from: John U.K. on November 10, 2024, 07:48:10 am
Well it looks like a pedestrian area, but there are plenty of cars about.

Please post a GSV link to the location.

The items you collected seems to fit the loading criteria - have you itemised invoices?


John thanks for your reply.

You are correct there are is a constant flow of traffic and parking on that road including vans.

From my local knowledge it is not a pedestrian zone after 5:00 pm Monday - Saturday. Plenty of cars and vans park on the High Street after 5:00 p.m. Before 5:00 pm; vehicles drive through and park Monday - Saturday for pickup / delivery from the shops. On Sunday vehicles park on the high street from early morning. After midday its full of parked vehicles.  I have never actually seen any signage or template / restrictions on entering from Batchelor Street turning right into the High Street with Barclays Bank on the corner.
I don't have an itemised invoice. The items were not available ( in stock) as per my original post and they went to the stock room to check if they had any hence the wait and I ended up having a ticket.
I haven't been able to post the GSV link onto the post or reply. I must be doing something wrong. The PCN doesn’t give the exact location where I parked. The High street is very long. 
The address is
London Cash and Carry
291 -293 High Street
Chatham
ME4 4BN

GSV Link Chatham High Street

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/uv?pb=!1s0x47d8cd0f6ec3825f%3A0x4e488785f835c5be!3m1!7e115!4s%2Fmaps%2Fplace%2Flondon%2Bcash%2Band%2Bcarry%2Bchatham%2F%4051.3808701%2C0.5286878%2C3a%2C75y%2C341.74h%2C90t%2Fdata%3D*213m4*211e1*213m2*211s8Z1F_b7LRTpkOdx_25WT-A*212e0*214m2*213m1*211s0x47d8cd0f6ec3825f%3A0x4e488785f835c5be%3Fsa%3DX%26ved%3D2ahUKEwjsueCAgtKJAxUSTkEAHS1YN9IQpx96BAgJEAA!5slondon%20cash%20and%20carry%20chatham%20-%20Google%20Search!15sCgIgARICCAI&imagekey=!1e2!2s8Z1F_b7LRTpkOdx_25WT-A&cr=le_a7&hl=en&ved=1t%3A206134&ictx=111

 

I checked the Medway website before posting and it was showing as £35. I also allowed me to start the appeal. I haven't submitted anything yet. The 14 day from date of issue ends today midnight 10th November. From my previous experience the discounted amount is usually available one day over 14 days
Thanks



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JOJO1209

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Re: Medway Code 01 - Parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours
« Reply #4 on: November 10, 2024, 05:40:27 pm »
Quote from: H C Andersen on November 10, 2024, 12:21:21 pm
PCN served 27 Oct.
14-day statutory discount period ended 9 Nov, yesterday.

By your account you were shopping and therefore on the face of it a loading exemption would not apply.

What was your route to this location i.e. where did you pass the signs which created the restriction?

I came in through Batchelor Street turned left into the high street Barclays Bank on the corner.
I didn't see any restriction sign(s). Lots of vehicle were parked and or drove through Batchelor street and unto the High street around where I parked
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JOJO1209

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Re: Medway Code 01 - Parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours
« Reply #5 on: November 10, 2024, 05:48:06 pm »
Quote from: H C Andersen on November 10, 2024, 12:21:21 pm
PCN served 27 Oct.
14-day statutory discount period ended 9 Nov, yesterday.

By your account you were shopping and therefore on the face of it a loading exemption would not apply.

What was your route to this location i.e. where did you pass the signs which created the restriction?


Just checked Medway website again at 17:43hrs the PCN is still showing at the discounted price. I took printed the page as evidence of the discount amount.
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John U.K.

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Re: Medway Code 01 - Parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours
« Reply #6 on: November 10, 2024, 06:58:47 pm »
Presumably you parked somewhere here?
https://maps.app.goo.gl/u3Yb8rs5Do6hTegu9
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H C Andersen

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Re: Medway Code 01 - Parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours
« Reply #7 on: November 10, 2024, 08:05:06 pm »
GSV shows clear Ped Area signs(which are moving traffic and not relevant for these purposes).

Can you return and take current photos pl. I won't go into the reasons yet, let's see the evidence first pl.

GSV (7 years old) also shows No Entry from Batchelor to High St, so it's of limited use. Can you give us a full range of photos pl?
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Incandescent

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Re: Medway Code 01 - Parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours
« Reply #8 on: November 10, 2024, 08:13:08 pm »
Quote from: JOJO1209 on November 10, 2024, 05:40:27 pm
Quote from: H C Andersen on November 10, 2024, 12:21:21 pm
PCN served 27 Oct.
14-day statutory discount period ended 9 Nov, yesterday.

By your account you were shopping and therefore on the face of it a loading exemption would not apply.

What was your route to this location i.e. where did you pass the signs which created the restriction?

I came in through Batchelor Street turned left into the high street Barclays Bank on the corner.
I didn't see any restriction sign(s). Lots of vehicle were parked and or drove through Batchelor street and unto the High street around where I parked
If your approach was via Batchelor Street, them you should have passed these signs: -
https://maps.app.goo.gl/fk6Tfkt26WvG9aq5A
Note that the restriction applies on all days of the week, and there is a sign that bars stopping at any time.  Are those signs still there ?
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JOJO1209

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Re: Medway Code 01 - Parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours
« Reply #9 on: November 10, 2024, 11:48:14 pm »
Quote from: H C Andersen on November 10, 2024, 08:05:06 pm
GSV shows clear Ped Area signs(which are moving traffic and not relevant for these purposes).

Can you return and take current photos pl. I won't go into the reasons yet, let's see the evidence first pl.

GSV (7 years old) also shows No Entry from Batchelor to High St, so it's of limited use. Can you give us a full range of photos pl?


Okay will do that.

Is there anything in particular that you want me to take photo of?

What specific area do you want me to take a pictures of as the High street is quite long.

Thanks
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H C Andersen

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Re: Medway Code 01 - Parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours
« Reply #10 on: November 11, 2024, 08:22:50 am »
The signs on entering Batchelor, the signs as you leave Batchelor to enter High St, any signs within, say, 25m either side of where your car was parked.

The types of signs we're looking for:

Diagrams 1 and 2 in the Part 2 table here: https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2016/362/schedule/8/made

Anything with the words Restricted Parking Zone;

Signs 1 and 2 in the Part 2 table here: https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2016/362/schedule/5/made

Anything with item 2 in the Part 2 table here: https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2016/362/schedule/4/made


In essence, as there aren't any yellow lines the council are relying upon entrance and repeater signs within a zone. But which type of zone and restricted hours are the issues. A Pedestrian zone or Restricted Parking zone, neither of which allows the use of No Stopping signs which GSV shows were present in the past.
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JOJO1209

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Re: Medway Code 01 - Parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours
« Reply #11 on: November 11, 2024, 03:55:21 pm »
Quote from: John U.K. on November 10, 2024, 06:58:47 pm
Presumably you parked somewhere here?
https://maps.app.goo.gl/u3Yb8rs5Do6hTegu9

Thanks John for uploading the google street view map.

As Andersen said this street view is 7 years old and a lot has changed on the High Street.
I was parked in front of No264 - Wendy's Kitchen which is no longer there. The shop has been empty for a long time. There was no space to pack in front of London Cash and Carry shop.

Please can you point out to me were the pedestrian signs and time restrictions signs are on the picture so I can double check if they are still there when I go down the High Street next time.
Quote from: H C Andersen on November 11, 2024, 08:22:50 am
The signs on entering Batchelor, the signs as you leave Batchelor to enter High St, any signs within, say, 25m either side of where your car was parked.

The types of signs we're looking for:

Diagrams 1 and 2 in the Part 2 table here: https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2016/362/schedule/8/made

Anything with the words Restricted Parking Zone;

Signs 1 and 2 in the Part 2 table here: https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2016/362/schedule/5/made

Anything with item 2 in the Part 2 table here: https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2016/362/schedule/4/made


In essence, as there aren't any yellow lines the council are relying upon entrance and repeater signs within a zone. But which type of zone and restricted hours are the issues. A Pedestrian zone or Restricted Parking zone, neither of which allows the use of No Stopping signs which GSV shows were present in the past.

Thanks for this very educative and enlightening .

I am going down there soon. Hopefully it is no too dark to get good clear pictures by the time I get there.

I will post pictures when I get home. I don't have the login on my phone. 
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Incandescent

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Re: Medway Code 01 - Parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours
« Reply #12 on: November 11, 2024, 06:07:09 pm »
Maybe you could respond on my post about the signs in Batchelor St, shown on GSV in 2022.
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JOJO1209

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Re: Medway Code 01 - Parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours
« Reply #13 on: November 12, 2024, 04:34:48 pm »
Quote from: Incandescent on November 10, 2024, 08:13:08 pm
Quote from: JOJO1209 on November 10, 2024, 05:40:27 pm
Quote from: H C Andersen on November 10, 2024, 12:21:21 pm
PCN served 27 Oct.
14-day statutory discount period ended 9 Nov, yesterday.

By your account you were shopping and therefore on the face of it a loading exemption would not apply.

What was your route to this location i.e. where did you pass the signs which created the restriction?

I came in through Batchelor Street turned left into the high street Barclays Bank on the corner.
I didn't see any restriction sign(s). Lots of vehicle were parked and or drove through Batchelor street and unto the High street around where I parked
If your approach was via Batchelor Street, them you should have passed these signs: -
https://maps.app.goo.gl/fk6Tfkt26WvG9aq5A
Note that the restriction applies on all days of the week, and there is a sign that bars stopping at any time.  Are those signs still there ?

Sorry I didn't see the last part of your message about the 2022 GSV. I saw the first 2 messages and replied.

I hadn't been back to the High street to double check for these signs when you sent it.

In response to your message about the GSV 2022 and the signs.
Only one sign is still there the one on the left. See below for details.

I went there yesterday evening and there is only one sign on the left hand side (took pictures). The other sign on the right is no longer there. It appears to have been removed. I was parked on the High Street in front of Wendy's kitchen which is more than 7 meters away from this sign and there are no yellow lines or the same signs to suggest repeater.  There are no signs about parking / driving on the high street from the direction I was driving from or towards. I checked all the lamp posts around where I parked up to more that 12 metres on the high street from where I drove past and towards where I exited and there are no restriction signs that can be seen in that direction. 

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JOJO1209

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Re: Medway Code 01 - Parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours
« Reply #14 on: November 12, 2024, 04:48:21 pm »
Quote from: H C Andersen on November 11, 2024, 08:22:50 am
The signs on entering Batchelor, the signs as you leave Batchelor to enter High St, any signs within, say, 25m either side of where your car was parked.

The types of signs we're looking for:

Diagrams 1 and 2 in the Part 2 table here: https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2016/362/schedule/8/made

Anything with the words Restricted Parking Zone;

Signs 1 and 2 in the Part 2 table here: https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2016/362/schedule/5/made

Anything with item 2 in the Part 2 table here: https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2016/362/schedule/4/made


In essence, as there aren't any yellow lines the council are relying upon entrance and repeater signs within a zone. But which type of zone and restricted hours are the issues. A Pedestrian zone or Restricted Parking zone, neither of which allows the use of No Stopping signs which GSV shows were present in the past.


There is one entry restrictions on Bachelor Street ( never noticed them till yesterday) on the left. The one on the right as per GSV 2022 is no longer there.
I took some pictures yesterday evening and checked all the lamp post around where I parked on the high street. I cannot find any signs. It will be helpful if you can review the pictures as you very knowledgeable on this subject. I am having problems uploading the pictures.  Please can I email them to you or someone with the expertise of using Imgur for you to help me upload them.  I  can private message my email address vice versa.

Many thanks
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