Author Topic: London Borough of Hounslow - Contravention 21 - parked in suspended bay  (Read 951 times)

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Evening all,

I would be grateful for any advice on this matter. Hounslow council seem to believe my partner parked in a suspended parking bay, however as you will see, this is not at all clear.

Contravention Code: 21
Parked wholly or partly in a suspended bay or space

The location is 1 Cranbrook Road, Chiswick, London W4 2LH
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Cranbrook Road is a one-way road with numbers 2 - 28 at the front, followed by 1-3 further down. The signage outside Number 3 states that the length of the parking bay outside 1-3 is suspended (note bay singular, not bays). 1 is the white house and 3 is the greyer house, which are side by side with a parking bay outside of them where the suspension sign is positioned. My partner was parked where the blue Audi is now parked.

Clearly this suspension is in order to accommodate the Skip, which is correctly positioned in that bay.

However my partner was ticketed around the corner, beside Number 1, not in front of. Granted the front door of the house is at the side, however surely the bay that is being suspended is the one outside 1-3, not the one beside number 1? If indeed there is a suspension of the bay beside number 1 to accommodate a second skip should there not be additional signage on the post next to that bay?

crucially, this is a one-way road, so if you were to park where the blue Audi is parked in order to walk back towards the front of the road you would never know about the suspension because the sign is around the bend in front of the other bay.

Has the parking enforcement officer just misinterpreted the suspension, or have the council erected inadequate signage?

















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Is it possible to request precise location of a parking bay from GPS coordinates or something? It seems like anyone could call anything 'suspended', and not have any proof to verify it.

Anybody know if this should be contested on the basis of inadequate signage, or the parking officer misinterpreting the suspended bay?

I'll need to make my representations soon. Can anyone point me to a similar case, and if an argument was successfully used to appeal a mislabeled suspended bay?

You appear to hae a very strong case, because there are double-yellow lines separating the bay round the corner and the one where the suspension sign is located, on the restriction sign for that bay.  It looks as if they have made a complete Dogs Breakfast of the suspension details, so if it were me, I'd be taking them all the way on this one, right up to London Tribunals.  If they really did mean the bay where you parked was suspended then they were obliged to put a suspension sign on the sign for the bay where you parked.

So provided you are up for it, submit a challenge as follows:

Dear Sirs

PCN No <nnn> date <date>

The offence did not occur, because the car was parked in a separate bay to the bay with the suspension sign upon it. The restrictions sign for the bay where I parked had no suspension sign displayed.

They will respond with the usual Fob-Off letter, and you must be prepared to wait for the Notice to Owner and submit reps again.

Don't fold and feed their coffers with gold !

Thank you for that. I'm 100% in agreement. I will keep my representations brief then; I was intending a more lengthy argument to ensure that there would be no room for ambiguity and that they would cancel straight away, but if you think I'll get the standard fob-off, then there's no point in going to that effort at this stage.

Experience of this forum is that informal challenges are mosty not even read, the official concerned just presses a few buttons and gets a Fob-Off letter sent out. They game the system like this because most people then cough-up thinking the council know the law they are enforcing; a naive assumption !

Formal representations are considered in more detail.
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@efunc these are the council photos:













Aside from the fact that you can't even read the wording on the suspension sign, the photos prove beyond reasonable doubt that you were not in a suspended bay. It's worth writing some compelling representations that point this out to the council and I would include a threat of costs if they reject, as it would be wholly unreasonable for the council to issue a formal notice of rejection and if they do, then they need to be taught a lesson.
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
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Thank you for that. Incredible! 5 pictures of the car in the parking bay, and a final picture of a completely separate bay around the corner!

I will put something together this week, but entirely expect to get a rejection shortly afterwards...

I will put something together this week, but entirely expect to get a rejection shortly afterwards...
Post a draft on here before submitting it to the council.
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order

Something like this?

 

Dear Sir/Madam

PCN No NJ40245618
date 08/06/2024

I was extremely dismayed to find a PCN placed on the windscreen of my car parked in Cranbrook Road, Chiswick, London W4 on the 8th June 2024, for the alleged Contravention Code: 21 (Parked wholly or partly in a suspended bay or space).

The notice attached to the post in front of number 3 Cranbrook Road stated that the parking bay in front of 1-3 was suspended in order to accommodate a skip. As my images show, the skip was already present in the parking bay in question. My car was parked in an entirely different bay around a 90 degree bend in the road and separated from the suspended bay by double yellow lines. Additionally, the post beside the bay that my vehicle was parked in did not have a parking suspension notice attached to it, indicating that it was not suspended.

The offence therefore, did not occur, and I would be grateful if you would cancel the PCN.

Regards

I would maybe clarify the wording a bit, saying that:

the notice outside #3 mentions the suspension of the parking bay (singular) outside numbers 1 to 3
However, the bay outside #1 is a different bay to that outside #3, as can be seen from the pictures which show they are separated by double yellow lines
Not only is suspending the bay outside #1 unnecessary for the installation of a skip, but, if you had wanted to suspend both bays, you would have had to i) install signs outside both bays and ii) specify that two separate bays were suspended. Instead, the picture shows that the pole next to your parked car outside #1 has no sign at all. No sign --> no valid suspension

Lastly, you might want to edit the photos with some arrows and text to make it even clearer
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Clearer?

Dear Sir/Madam

PCN No NJ40245618
date 08/06/2024

I was extremely dismayed to find a PCN placed on the windscreen of my car parked in Cranbrook Road, Chiswick, London W4 on the 8th June 2024, for the alleged Contravention Code: 21 (Parked wholly or partly in a suspended bay or space).

The notice attached to the post in front of number 3 Cranbrook Road stated that the parking bay (singular) in front of 1-3 was suspended in order to accommodate a skip. As my images show, the skip was already present in the single parking bay in question. My car however was not parked here, but in an entirely different bay, around a 90 degree bend in the road, and separated from the suspended bay by double yellow lines.

Additionally, the post beside the bay that my vehicle was parked in did not have a parking suspension notice attached to it, indicating that it was not suspended. If indeed it was suspended for a second skip then it would be a requirement to have erected a warning notice next to it, independent of the one around the blind corner in front of #1-3 of the one way road.

The offence therefore, did not occur, and I would be grateful if you would cancel the PCN.

Regards
« Last Edit: June 18, 2024, 05:29:31 pm by efunc »

Clearer. Best of luck! Keep us updated!

Thanks for your input. Final draft going in for submission:

Dear Sir/Madam

PCN No NJ40245618
date 08/06/2024

I was extremely dismayed to find a PCN placed on the windscreen of my car parked in Cranbrook Road, Chiswick, London W4 on the 8th June 2024, for the alleged Contravention Code: 21 (Parked wholly or partly in a suspended bay or space).

The notice attached to the post in front of number 3 Cranbrook Road stated that the parking bay (singular) in front of 1-3 was suspended in order to accommodate a skip. As my images show, the skip was already present in the single parking bay in question. My car however was not parked here, but in an entirely different bay, around a 90 degree bend in the road, and separated from the suspended bay by double yellow lines.

Additionally, the post beside the bay that my vehicle was parked in did not have a parking suspension notice attached to it, indicating that this one was not suspended. If indeed it was suspended for the provision of a second skip then it would have been incumbent on the council to have displayed a warning notice next to it, clearly visible, and independent of the one around the blind corner of the one way road in front of #1-3. The photos taken by your CEO confirm that none was present here.

The offence therefore, did not occur, and I would be grateful if you would cancel the PCN.

Regards,