Author Topic: Newham - Contravention Code 165, Parked in disabled bay without permit  (Read 1398 times)

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Hello,

Experienced a very unfortunate incident in Newham recently. I parked my car in what appeared to be a standard residential bay at night, as the road markings indicating a disabled bay were faded and obscured. I possess a valid permit for residential parking and assumed it was applicable to the spot where I parked.

I went on holiday the day after and so the car remained in the same spot for a few days. Upon returning from holiday, I discovered that my car had been towed, and I received three Penalty Charge Notices. I paid £200 plus one PCN charge (total: £265) to retrieve my vehicle. However, I haven't settled the remaining two PCNs yet.

I've attached images of the PCNs I received: https://imgur.com/a/BVae7W5

Additionally, I've provided pictures of the bay at night where I parked: https://imgur.com/a/OeSt5VZ (during the day, its slightly more noticeable which is depicted in the council images but on a rainy night, its very easy to miss)

As evident from my images, the road markings indicating the disabled bay are severely faded and covered over. Consequently, I mistakenly assumed it was a standard residential bay. Although there is a pole sign indicating it's a disabled permit bay, naturally, I didn't think to check this, especially on a rainy night where it's not exactly noticeable.

Considering the faded road markings, do I have any grounds for appeal? This unexpected situation has been quite distressing, especially after returning from a holiday.

Any guidance or assistance you can provide would be greatly appreciated.
« Last Edit: February 24, 2024, 12:15:14 pm by Ayze »

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Re: Newham - Contravention Code 165, Parked in disabled bay without permit
« Reply #1 on: »
We need to see the council photos please get and post them also post a GSV

on the face of it you have a couple of arguments but we need to see more to be sure

Re: Newham - Contravention Code 165, Parked in disabled bay without permit
« Reply #2 on: »
This concerns a "Disabled resident permit holders only" bay. GSV here.

Looks like there was a road surface repair/patch some years ago, The DISABLED legend was badly repainted and has now worn away. GSV suggests the legend has been repainted several times. I don't know if that will be enough for the Adjudicator, since the upright sign adjacent to the bay is fine.

What date did you park the car in the bay?

You've posted up three PCNs for three successive days, 16th, 17th & 18th Feb. Seems the Council have applied your £65 payment to the last PCN, the one issued on the 18th. This is a continuous contravention so the Council when challenged should only enforce one PCN, usually the first, and should cancel the other two.

LK68 HFE
PN37974976 18/02/2024
PN37998158 17/02/2024
PN37986363 16/02/2024

What I find strange is that the evidence photos for the first PCN, the one issued on the 16th, show two PCN envelopes on the windscreen under the wiper blade. There should only be one. The evidence photos for the second PCN, the one issued on the 17th, still show two PCN envelopes on the windscreen in the same place. The photos for the 17th show three PCN envelopes in the same place.

This implies that one PCN was already present on the windscreen when the 16th Feb PCN was issued and served by the CEO. So where is it? Is there perhaps a fourth PCN you haven't yet told us about? Or maybe it was removed from the windscreen before the 17th Feb PCN was issued? Did anyone else have access to the car while you were away?

I also find it unusual that they took so long to remove your car. I would have expected it to be lifted on the 16th or at latest the morning of the 17th when the CEO discovered it was still there with PCN(s) attached. Disabled bays are meant to be a high priority for vehicle removals.

You should make sure that you get representations against the first two PCNs delivered to the Council before Thursday the 29th Feb. This to preserve your discount if they reject. Cross reference all three PCNS in any correspondence.

See what others have to say. And then post up a draft of your reps.
« Last Edit: February 24, 2024, 11:43:43 pm by Enceladus »

There should be double bay divider lines to indicate the change of restriction between the disabled bay and the residents' bay, so the road markings are incorrect.

@Ayze have you challenged the removal PCN? You're almost out of time.

The principal traffic order is The Newham (Disabled Persons) (Community Parking) (Special Parking Area) (No. 1) Order 2007 but it does not include this bay, so there must be a later amendment (I have requested all amending orders).
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order

@Ayze any updates?

I've finally got hold of The Newham (Disabled Persons) (Community Parking) (Special Parking Area) (No. 1, 2007) (Amendment No. 23) Order 2022, but if you've not made a representation already you're way past the deadline now.
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order

@Ayze any updates?

I've finally got hold of The Newham (Disabled Persons) (Community Parking) (Special Parking Area) (No. 1, 2007) (Amendment No. 23) Order 2022, but if you've not made a representation already you're way past the deadline now.

Hey there,

I'm so sorry for not responding sooner. I completely forgot about this post.

So i had my appeal rejected by Newham Council. I've submitted a further appeal through the tribunal and hope to hear from them by the end of this month.

Am i too late to amend the appeal? If not, i would appreciate any pointers to add in relation to the amendment order.


Quote
Am i too late to amend the appeal? If not, i would appreciate any pointers to add in relation to the amendment order.

1) Did you opt for a personal or telephone hearing? If not please ring LT and change it from a postal.

2) For meaningful advice, please post here a copy a your tribunal appeal

So i had my appeal rejected by Newham Council. I've submitted a further appeal through the tribunal and hope to hear from them by the end of this month.
@Ayze with respect, you're doing this all wrong. Your post indicates you've opted for a postal hearing, which is a terrible idea as illustrated by this sad case: https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/warwickshire-cc-pcn-code-24-not-within-markings-of-bay-lakin-road-warwick/

I suggest you start by calling the tribunal and asking for a hearing (you can attend by telephone or a representative can attend on your behalf), you then want to download the whole evidence pack from the tribunal portal at https://londontribunals.org.uk/ and put it in a google drive or dropbox folder so that we can see what we're dealing with.

If you go in blind with a postal appeal and only update us to say you've lost, it'll be too late for us to do anything about it, as explained in the thread I've linked to above.
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order