Author Topic: Haringey PCN - Code 21(I) Parked in a suspended bay - La Rose Lane  (Read 2256 times)

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Re: Haringey PCN - Code 21(I) Parked in a suspended bay - La Rose Lane
« Reply #30 on: »
I actually found a word document where I saved my original appeal.

This is what I said:

Hi,

I would like to challenge this PCN as I genuinely thought I was parking in an area that I was allowed to park. I noticed the signs that the parking bays was suspened but I parked nearer to where there were no signs. I also displayed a resident permit ticket.

My parents live at LeRose Lane and as I used to live there, my GP is in West Green Road. I had a medical appointment at Laurence House Surgery and I was running late, I did not realise that the signs were displaying bay numbers. I was parked nearer to a sign that did not mention the bays were suspended.

I would like to challenge for the following reasons:

1. I had a medical appointment.

2. I was parked nearer to a sign that did not display any warnings about suspended bays.

3. I had resident tickets displayed (as seen in the pictures taken) so it was a genuine mistake.

4. I have never received a Haringey PCN before so I would be grateful for leniency.

I look forward to hearing from you.

Kind regards


I could try the same appeal? Can I ask in what way the signage was inadequate?

Re: Haringey PCN - Code 21(I) Parked in a suspended bay - La Rose Lane
« Reply #31 on: »
your point 2 shows the signage to be inadequate as the suspended area exceeds the span of the signs
I help you pro bono (for free). I now ask that a £40 donation is made to the North London Hospice before I take over your case. I have an 85% success rate across 2,000 PCNs but some PCNs can't be beaten and I will tell you if your case looks hopeless before asking you to donate.
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Re: Haringey PCN - Code 21(I) Parked in a suspended bay - La Rose Lane
« Reply #32 on: »
I'm so sorry, I thought I updated this post.

I appealed on the 24th November with the following:

Hi,

I would like to challenge this PCN as I genuinely thought I was parking in an area that I was allowed to park. I noticed the signs that the parking bays was suspended but I parked nearer to where there were no signs. I also displayed a resident permit ticket.

My parents live at LaRose Lane and as I used to live there, my GP is in West Green Road. I had a medical appointment at Laurence House Surgery and I was running late, I did not realise that the signs were displaying bay numbers. I was parked nearer to a sign that did not mention the bays were suspended.

I would like to challenge for the following reasons:

1. I had a medical appointment.

2. I was parked nearer to a sign that did not display any warnings about suspended bays. There was a sign as attached outside 52 but there was no signage after 52. This shows the signage to be inadequate as the suspended area exceeds the span of the signs.

3. I had resident tickets displayed (as seen in the pictures taken) so it was a genuine mistake.

4. I have never received a Haringey PCN before so I would be grateful for leniency.

I look forward to hearing from you.

Kind regards


It was the same as my previous appeal but I expanded on point 2.

I will update once I get a reply.

Thanks again

Re: Haringey PCN - Code 21(I) Parked in a suspended bay - La Rose Lane
« Reply #33 on: »
I just received a letter from Haringey council. Rejected again.

They said that the warnings were sufficient.

They offered the discount again.

Re: Haringey PCN - Code 21(I) Parked in a suspended bay - La Rose Lane
« Reply #34 on: »
Better that we see the actual letter with only your name and address covered up
I help you pro bono (for free). I now ask that a £40 donation is made to the North London Hospice before I take over your case. I have an 85% success rate across 2,000 PCNs but some PCNs can't be beaten and I will tell you if your case looks hopeless before asking you to donate.

Re: Haringey PCN - Code 21(I) Parked in a suspended bay - La Rose Lane
« Reply #35 on: »
Here is the letter

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Re: Haringey PCN - Code 21(I) Parked in a suspended bay - La Rose Lane
« Reply #36 on: »
A tough one.
IF YOU RECEIVE A MOVING TRAFFIC PCN PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE MAKING A REPRESENTATION:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/moving-traffic-pcns-missing-mandatory-information-the-london-local-authorities-a/msg102639/#msg102639


How do we get more people to fight their PCNs?

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/how-do-we-get-more-people-to-fight-their-pcns/msg41917/#msg41917

If you do not even make a challenge, you will surely join "The Mugged Club".

I am not omniscient. cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

My e mail address for councils:

J.BOND007@H.M.S.S.c/oVAUXHALLBRIDGE/LICENSEDTOEXPOSE.SCAMS.CO.UK

Last mission accomplished:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/southwark-to-r

Re: Haringey PCN - Code 21(I) Parked in a suspended bay - La Rose Lane
« Reply #37 on: »
Ok ltn_hell. It is decision time. Carry on fighting which i presume is why you came to this forum, and forget about the 50% discount, or meekly pay up.

We have two balls lined up in front of goal:

1    PCN wording (I have scored with this previously)
2    Inadequate signage.

We only have to get one ball into the net. I am happy to take to the field of play for you. email mrmustard@zoho.com with an unredacted copy of the Notice of Rejection. I would be hopeful of winning at the tribunal.
« Last Edit: December 27, 2023, 09:05:59 am by mrmustard »
I help you pro bono (for free). I now ask that a £40 donation is made to the North London Hospice before I take over your case. I have an 85% success rate across 2,000 PCNs but some PCNs can't be beaten and I will tell you if your case looks hopeless before asking you to donate.

Re: Haringey PCN - Code 21(I) Parked in a suspended bay - La Rose Lane
« Reply #38 on: »
Appeal started. Will report the outcome in due course.
I help you pro bono (for free). I now ask that a £40 donation is made to the North London Hospice before I take over your case. I have an 85% success rate across 2,000 PCNs but some PCNs can't be beaten and I will tell you if your case looks hopeless before asking you to donate.

Re: Haringey PCN - Code 21(I) Parked in a suspended bay - La Rose Lane
« Reply #39 on: »
Appeal started. Will report the outcome in due course.

Thank you so much for all your kind help!

Re: Haringey PCN - Code 21(I) Parked in a suspended bay - La Rose Lane
« Reply #40 on: »
What no-one seems to have looked at so far is Haringey's authorisation from the DfT for its temporary parking suspension signage. Surprising theough it might seem, Haringey obtained its authorisation back in 2011 and appears never to have updated it. Here it is:

https://assets.dft.gov.uk/trafficauths/case-2964.pdf

You will note at para 1(a) that it states specifically that the year should be omitted from the suspension notice. And the sign as photographed clearly shows the year as "23". This was common rubric back at that time and a lot of councils have updated their authorisations to provide that the year may or may not be shown. However it seems that Haringey have been lazy and a) have not updated the auth and b) simply copied RBKC's diagram as you can see from the authority name on the bottom. However note that at 1(c) the authority name may be varied or omitted so this is not evidence of non-compliance in itself.

I never understood why the original batch of authorisations provided for omission of the year but the fact is that they did and if the authorisation specifically states that the year should be omitted and it is in fact included, this looks like a non-compliant sign to me. As a secondary matter, I can't tell from the photos as posted whether the suspension signs have the side-wings with the appropriate verbiage but if not, this would be additional evidence of non-compliance.

One for Mr Mustard to consider in drafting up a formal appeal but it must be one more football lined up in front of the goalmouth - or at least an indirect free kick  :)

Re: Haringey PCN - Code 21(I) Parked in a suspended bay - La Rose Lane
« Reply #41 on: »
Sorry I can see the side-wings in post #12. Looks compliant.

Re: Haringey PCN - Code 21(I) Parked in a suspended bay - La Rose Lane
« Reply #42 on: »
Thanks Chaseman. Probably wait and see if the DoT authorisation finds itself in the evidence pack and if not try to eliminate the sign altogther as no proof of validity.

I have only been to the tribunal against Haringey 12 times since 2017. I am 12-0 in the lead.
I help you pro bono (for free). I now ask that a £40 donation is made to the North London Hospice before I take over your case. I have an 85% success rate across 2,000 PCNs but some PCNs can't be beaten and I will tell you if your case looks hopeless before asking you to donate.

Re: Haringey PCN - Code 21(I) Parked in a suspended bay - La Rose Lane
« Reply #43 on: »
My 28 day argument is now failing but luckily I went first of all with the inadequate signage in the Appeal which i started on 29 December.

It is the duty of the EA to erect sufficient signs as to convey adequate information to motorists using the road. The EA erected a number of signs to try and indicate that the part of the bay from no. 4 to no. 54 was suspended. The first sign seen by motorists driving along was on the sign post roughly in line with the party wall of no's 6 & 8. Anyone parking outside no. 4, the start of the bay, would see that sign. The final sign was attached to the sign post outside of 48. It was behind the Appellant's car which was parked outside no. 54. The next sign post ahead, outside of 62 did not bear a suspension sign.

The effect of the missing sign was to make it appear that the place where the Appellant parked was not suspended. I think that in order to provide adequate information the EA should book end at least the suspended area plus a bit more if the location of the available posts so require.

The EA refer to a coned area in their Notice of Rejection. They have not provided evidence of the placement of cones, which would have been helpful to the Appellant in delineating the suspended area.


The in person hearing was listed for 1 February 2024. I just checked the portal for evidence and found a 'Do not Contest' cancellation from the council. Wise of them.
I help you pro bono (for free). I now ask that a £40 donation is made to the North London Hospice before I take over your case. I have an 85% success rate across 2,000 PCNs but some PCNs can't be beaten and I will tell you if your case looks hopeless before asking you to donate.

Re: Haringey PCN - Code 21(I) Parked in a suspended bay - La Rose Lane
« Reply #44 on: »
Re the 28 day argument: isn't it funny that, when "the usual suspects" establish a legal flaw, it soon begins to fail!?  Well done re the DNC.
IF YOU RECEIVE A MOVING TRAFFIC PCN PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE MAKING A REPRESENTATION:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/moving-traffic-pcns-missing-mandatory-information-the-london-local-authorities-a/msg102639/#msg102639


How do we get more people to fight their PCNs?

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/how-do-we-get-more-people-to-fight-their-pcns/msg41917/#msg41917

If you do not even make a challenge, you will surely join "The Mugged Club".

I am not omniscient. cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

My e mail address for councils:

J.BOND007@H.M.S.S.c/oVAUXHALLBRIDGE/LICENSEDTOEXPOSE.SCAMS.CO.UK

Last mission accomplished:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/southwark-to-r