Author Topic: Council PCN with blue badge  (Read 961 times)

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Council PCN with blue badge
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Hi all

Ive successfully fought private PCNs in the past however yesterday I unexpectedly received a council one..


Took my mum out for her birthday.. she has terminal cancer and at the moment can't walk.. we couldn't get close to the venue as a car was getting clamped (city centre) so nearest I parked was attached.

I saw the parking suspension sign but this looked further up where bays were coned off. I thought it would be fine in a bay, especially with a valid blue badge. There was nowhere else to park near the venue.

Do I have any options to fight?

I thought blue badge allows any parking for 3 hours (even double yellows)

The suspension also does not state duration.

Thanks


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Re: Council PCN with blue badge
« Reply #1 on: »
Yes it would seem there are a couple of reasons to challenge, that sign cannot mean anything and the barriers blocking some of the bays would give reason to believe it is those bays suspended

Post the back of the PCN and also reinstate your reg so we can check out all the council photos ( your reg is on show all the time so no need to hide it

Re: Council PCN with blue badge
« Reply #2 on: »
That suspension sign is no good as it's missing all the mandatory data, but firstly please give us the number plate so that we can check the council photos.

If it had been a properly signposted suspension your blue badge would not allow you to park there, but fortunately it was not a properly signposted suspension.
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order

Re: Council PCN with blue badge
« Reply #3 on: »
Thank you - as in my car number plate??

Re: Council PCN with blue badge
« Reply #4 on: »
Thank you - as in my car number plate??
Yes
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Re: Council PCN with blue badge
« Reply #5 on: »
HV69FTN thanks

Re: Council PCN with blue badge
« Reply #6 on: »
So it's the bays on the left here: https://maps.app.goo.gl/MtRy5t7cQkhPtFAb6

The civil enforcement officer took this photo:



However all the other photos are timed between 3:55 and 3:57, but the photo of the sign is timed 6 minutes later which suggests this sign was some significant distance from your car, and almost certainly not within sight of it.

Combined with your photo of the damaged sign, I think you have a compelling case. One thing I can't work out is where North Parade is, does anyone know where that might be?
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order

Re: Council PCN with blue badge
« Reply #7 on: »
Quote
One thing I can't work out is where North Parade is, does anyone know where that might be?

Not easy to find, however

https://www.openstreetmap.org/search?query=north%20parade%20M3%202NH#map=19/53.48248/-2.24842

It's very new
https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-e&q=north+parade+manchester

Re the suspension sign - it is "Back South Parade" as the street name, not 'back of South Parade'

The two streets are north and south of Parsonage Gardens

Re: Council PCN with blue badge
« Reply #8 on: »
Confused - I never saw that sign!!

Are there drafts to crib for council as I've done before for private ?

Re: Council PCN with blue badge
« Reply #9 on: »
Where are the signs that govern the bays?

When GSV last passed in 2021 there was a suspension here
https://maps.app.goo.gl/tvshzbPrtdQXhqwU9

using cones, but still no sign of a governing sign.

Is it in some sort of zone where parking in marked bays is permitted and the governing signs are at the boundary of the zone?

Found the parking meter -still there in the distance in 2022 but GSV is 2021 for close-up
https://maps.app.goo.gl/nWjzLZG8GL1qwm519

Did you pay for parking there?
« Last Edit: September 21, 2023, 06:56:40 pm by John U.K. »

Re: Council PCN with blue badge
« Reply #10 on: »
There is one sign at each end of the bays near to where the OP parked it is affixed to the wall and at the other end a post. I would suggest that the sign the OP photographed the one the CEO photoed was at the other end on the post For me the OP was entitled to believe the that any suspension was over

Re: Council PCN with blue badge
« Reply #11 on: »
Yeah so:

No cones were I parked

Sign on the meter where the cones were had no times on. I didn't pay (sign may block the machine)

The disabled parking opposite the venue wasn't accessible because the street was blocked by removing a clamped vehicle! So there was nowhere to park. If I'd have known I would have parked on double yellows, as you get 3 hours with a badge.

I thought 1) the restriction was over and 2) it was OK with a badge.

The fact further up there were cones, and then they stopped for a number of bays was not clear.

Re: Council PCN with blue badge
« Reply #12 on: »
Here is North Parade: https://maps.app.goo.gl/siCwA1FK6pLGYQfT6

It's not new at all as it was there in 2008 and has likely been there for decades if not centuries, it's just not mapped on google maps.

Anyway, this should be reasonably straightforward:

Dear Manchester City Council,

I challenge liability for PCN MC26350004 on the ground that the alleged contravention did not occur. This is because there was no signage in the vicinity of my car indicating the extent of any restrictions. While all the photos of my car were taken between 3:55 and 3:57 pm, the only photo the CEO took of the sign is timed at 4:03 pm, which suggests that the CEO had to walk no less than six minutes from my car to the sign. The sign cannot therefore have been visible from where my car was parked.

While there was a sign close to my car, that sign did not carry any information, I refer you to the photo I have uploaded at (link)

In light of the above the alleged contravention did not occur.

Yours faithfully,

I will PM you a link to put in the representation, it will redirect to https://imgur.com/a/NbJBKdJ but if you use the link I'll PM you, we can use the click count to confirm whether they've looked at it or not. If they don't click on it, we can then prove they've failed to consider all of the evidence. If they say in the rejection that they've considered all the evidence, we've got them for lying as well.
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order

Re: Council PCN with blue badge
« Reply #13 on: »
Perfect ! Thanks so much.

Yes sorry I clicked the link do I need new one to attach?

Re: Council PCN with blue badge
« Reply #14 on: »
Sorry I've seen you have pmd. Many thanks
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