Author Topic: Bury Council, Parking without permit, Back Rochdale Old Road, Bury (Read 431 times)

Crosshairsuk · « **on:** October 26, 2024, 10:35:15 am »

Hi everyone.I have received a PCN for not displaying a valid ticket or residents permit (it's not specific what I've breached as it was a generic list of breaches.l).
I challenged it immediately as the location on the ticket was incorrect, in fact the location doesn't exist at all.
I challenged that it was inadmissable and the closest location that had a similar name was not under any permit schemes etc.
The council enforcement company they use replied to my challenge, simply saying "Google maps is incorrect" , it isn't.
Do I have an appeal? One of the options s for appeal was that I wasn't at that location at that time, I provided irrefutable evidence what I wasn't (despite it not existing), the two aforementioned roads that are nearest to the one mentioned on the ticket in terms of road name, are 2.5 miles away from where I actually was.
Any advice appreciated
3 Rectory Ln
https://maps.app.goo.gl/UJsrbkYvjnKEe41Y6?g_st=ac
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1hKS4Waq6_Ie2WdJgQ4dY0Wa1q7tUoSQs/view?usp=drivesdk
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1hEDQ_66uFEC7LpPu70DpWEfOc38yFgj8/view?usp=drivesdk https://drive.google.com/file/d/1h3gYQs1BL094OzOxtUo4yQNWsdrgcSWT/view?usp=drivesdk

stamfordman · « **Reply #1 on:** October 26, 2024, 10:53:15 am »

Read this:

https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/read-this-first-before-posting-your-case!-this-section-is-for-council-tfl-dartme/

and change the title and post materials as asked.

John U.K. · « **Reply #2 on:** October 26, 2024, 10:56:47 am »

Your account dows not add up: "Today I received a PCN . . since when you've challenged and had a reply???

For meaningful advice please to have a read of
https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/read-this-first-before-posting-your-case!-this-section-is-for-council-tfl-dartme/

and post up copies of both sides of the PCN.
of your challenge,
of their response (redact only yr name & address from docs - leave everything else in),
any Council photos,
and a GSV link to the alleged location.

Crosshairsuk · « **Reply #3 on:** October 26, 2024, 02:27:26 pm »

I'm unsure how it doesn't add up. I went home and submitted a challenge and they replied within hours.
I've uploaded links etc of the PCN. Re the location on the PCN - Back Rochdale Old Road , this does not exist at all.
Only a 'North' and 'South' variant which is over 2 miles from where I actually was and regardless neither have any restrictions

RichardW · « **Reply #4 on:** October 26, 2024, 02:49:46 pm »

Your GSV links don't work - where were you actually parked? CEO has taken a picture of a residents only sign, but no context as to where it is vs where the car is parked.

John U.K. · « **Reply #5 on:** October 26, 2024, 03:06:23 pm »

Quote from: Crosshairsuk on October 26, 2024, 02:27:26 pm

I'm unsure how it doesn't add up. I went home and submitted a challenge and they replied within hours.
I'm sorry if I sounded doubtful. In over 10 years at FTLA and its predeccessor Pepipoo, I don't think I've ever seen a same day response from a Council - it's usually weeks or months. Kudos to Bury.

I've uploaded links etc of the PCN. Re the location on the PCN - Back Rochdale Old Road , this does not exist at all.
The first two 'links' are dead and the there is no page 1 of the PCN. Please could we see this, and a copy of your challenge. In view of the importance of the location, pleae post not only a link to GSV, but also a link to the map view of the location.

Only a 'North' and 'South' variant which is over 2 miles from where I actually was and regardless neither have any restrictions

Using your clue of "3 Rectory Lane"
I did find
https://www.google.com/maps/place/3+Rectory+Ln,+Bury+BL9+7TA/@53.601109,-2.259575,18.5z/data=!4m6!3m5!1s0x487bbb3a237751e1:0x972c77dc52f27fcf!8m2!3d53.6013107!4d-2.2594914!16s%2Fg%2F11cpfyfv31?entry=ttu&g_ep=EgoyMDI0MTAyMy4wIKXMDSoASAFQAw%3D%3D

and the location "Back [of] Rochdale Old Rd" from the rejection letter I would point out that the test for incorrect location is whether the registered keeper (not being the driver) would be able to recognise the location from the Notice to Owner.
Rochdale Old Road seems to be very long and has, no doubt, plenty of 'Back of'

I

Crosshairsuk · « **Reply #6 on:** October 26, 2024, 03:47:36 pm »

I wouldn't be able to recognise that location as it doesn't exist. I checked via a few map systems to be sure, and it doesn't. The response to my challenge wasn't helpful either. Also I noted the CEO has not recorded the colour of my car, simply put 'Other', (My car is as blue as the sky).
I guess I'll have to await the 28days and then appeal direct to the council?

John U.K. · « **Reply #7 on:** October 26, 2024, 05:14:42 pm »

Sorry, should have been clearer -I meant the location of where the car was when the PCN was affixed.
Still need to see the front page of the PCN and a copy of your challenge.

catnip · « **Reply #8 on:** October 26, 2024, 05:29:03 pm »

Quote from: Crosshairsuk on October 26, 2024, 03:47:36 pm

I wouldn't be able to recognise that location as it doesn't exist. I checked via a few map systems to be sure, and it doesn't.

The location Back Rochdale Old Road is here.

Clearly, this is not where you were parked. So the location on the PCN is incorrect.

I believe you were parked here:
Rectory Lane

Hope this helps!

Crosshairsuk · « **Reply #9 on:** October 26, 2024, 05:55:06 pm »

That's Back Rochdale Old Road South there's a north also, both are 2.5 miles away. I was parked in a cut through of Rectory lane.
I posted a link to the PCN copy apologies if it didn't work, here is a link to GDrive Folder with it and my challenge and the response

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1h3KJC5add9sCsp8ZgLomImoW8GMeTaeB

stamfordman · « **Reply #10 on:** October 26, 2024, 06:04:45 pm »

I think you confused them by insisting the location on the PCN doesn't exist rather than it just being the wrong location, which in this case should be fatal to them.

Just wait for the notice to owner - are you the registered keeper and is the logbook correct with address.

John U.K. · « **Reply #11 on:** October 26, 2024, 06:31:29 pm »

Has Catnip correctly identified your location?

Rectory Lane is in Parking Zone C.

Back Rochdale Old Road N or S does not appear in Buryr's RPZ list (last update 2021)
https://www.bury.gov.uk/roads-travel-and-parking/parking/apply-for-a-parking-permit/resident-parking-scheme-permits/resident-parking-scheme-zones

Any Council photos on Council website? This would confirm your location on Rectory Lane at the time on the PCN, which makes it impossible for the vehicle to have been in any Back Rochdale Old Road.

Wrong location is fatal to a PCN, and the Council cannot re-issue with the right location.

Crosshairsuk · « **Reply #12 on:** October 26, 2024, 06:36:34 pm »

I was parked Rectory Lane, there are no images of the location etc. Just pictur s or my car and then a picture of a sign re: Permits needed that could be anywhere on earth.
I've added the pictures to the GDrive link.
Even the CEOs images have a location stamp saying Back Rochdale Old Road.
Appreciate everyones responses so far thank you

Crosshairsuk · « **Reply #13 on:** October 26, 2024, 06:45:46 pm »

Quote from: stamfordman on October 26, 2024, 06:04:45 pm

I think you confused them by insisting the location on the PCN doesn't exist rather than it just being the wrong location, which in this case should be fatal to them.

Just wait for the notice to owner - are you the registered keeper and is the logbook correct with address.

It's a lease vehicle under NHS

John U.K. · « **Reply #14 on:** October 26, 2024, 07:09:47 pm »

So, the car was parked where the red car is here
https://maps.app.goo.gl/hmAYXM86M2MifG9R7

Leased cars add to complications, as the NtO will be sent to the Lease Company. What is the Lease Company / NHS policy on PCNs?

Although not named on Open Street Map, Ordnance Survey(NLS). Bing Maps, etc. I did find it here As Back Old Rochdale Road (but with lots of lengths missing?)

https://www.findmystreet.co.uk/map?usrn=5102732

Perhaps Google is mistaken?

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Author Topic: Bury Council, Parking without permit, Back Rochdale Old Road, Bury (Read 431 times)

Crosshairsuk

Bury Council, Parking without permit, Back Rochdale Old Road, Bury

stamfordman

Re: Council PCn issues but location incorrect

John U.K.

Re: Council PCn issues but location incorrect

Crosshairsuk

Re: Bury Council, Parking without permit, Back Rochdale Old Road, Bury

RichardW

Re: Bury Council, Parking without permit, Back Rochdale Old Road, Bury

John U.K.

Re: Bury Council, Parking without permit, Back Rochdale Old Road, Bury

Crosshairsuk

Re: Bury Council, Parking without permit, Back Rochdale Old Road, Bury

John U.K.

Re: Bury Council, Parking without permit, Back Rochdale Old Road, Bury

catnip

Re: Bury Council, Parking without permit, Back Rochdale Old Road, Bury

Crosshairsuk

Re: Bury Council, Parking without permit, Back Rochdale Old Road, Bury

stamfordman

Re: Bury Council, Parking without permit, Back Rochdale Old Road, Bury

John U.K.

Re: Bury Council, Parking without permit, Back Rochdale Old Road, Bury

Crosshairsuk

Re: Bury Council, Parking without permit, Back Rochdale Old Road, Bury

Crosshairsuk

Re: Bury Council, Parking without permit, Back Rochdale Old Road, Bury

John U.K.

Re: Bury Council, Parking without permit, Back Rochdale Old Road, Bury