3. Code 01 parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours - faded double yellows
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Code 01 parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours - faded double yellows
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Hi everyone

I'm just after some advice please. I received a pcn a couple of days ago. I parked in Greenock Street, Liverpool, there are faded/worn double yellow lines on a small section of the road, this is where I parked. I work in the area and have parked there before with no issues, I've also seen other people parked in the same spot many times (I know that's not a defence, just giving some context) pics below.


Link to pcn:
https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/dd7ntaqzh4nxkxpchvunq/20231118_103944.jpg?rlkey=8zchnvfebkdlk5baxd2u03saa&dl=0


Google street view:
11 Greenock St
https://maps.app.goo.gl/MuAPrP4cvGLKUcqY7


Pcn evidence pics:


https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/gdjgj6vpww28ukwfu6ena/Screenshot_20231118_111427_Chrome.jpg?rlkey=wl3qmjjjmlrbx0ic3jw1my7pw&dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/j1l818qjxtihb2nr4541e/Screenshot_20231118_111440_Chrome.jpg?rlkey=cn6javfoeeclxzvu9d1z7ql2k&dl=0


The evidence pics show that the double yellow lines are very clear half way up the street, they are then broken by a small section of pavement, after this they are faded/worn away.


Am I bang to rights here? Or would there be any grounds to appeal based on the faded lines? Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
Laura
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Re: Code 01 parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours - faded double yellows
« Reply #1 on: »
I think they're having a laugh, at your expense.  HOwever, don't expect them to roll over like spaniels and cancel the PCN; this is a money-making game for them, so any informal reps will be rejected thus forcing you decide whether to cough-up or take the double-or-quits gamble of waiting for the Notice to Owner.
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Re: Code 01 parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours - faded double yellows
« Reply #2 on: »
They're having a laugh:











Nice and simple:

Dear Liverpool City Council,

The alleged contravention did not occur. While I accept road markings do not need to be kept in pristine condition, the road markings on this occasion have all but vanished and give the impression of a restriction that is no longer in force.

As the council has defaulted on its duties under regulation 18(1)(b) of The Local Authorities' Traffic Orders (Procedure) (England and Wales) Regulations 1996, the contravention did not occur and the penalty charge must be cancelled.

Yours faithfully,

Send it online and keep a screenshot of the confirmation screen.
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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
Re: Code 01 parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours - faded double yellows
« Reply #3 on: »
Thank you so much for the replies and advice, I have sent the challenge today.
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Re: Code 01 parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours - faded double yellows
« Reply #4 on: »
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Re: Code 01 parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours - faded double yellows
« Reply #5 on: »
Well, one can neer predict the rulings of adjudicators, but these lines are in a completely laughable state, sufficiently worn out such that any normal person would there is no restriction there any more. It is an insult, frankly, for them to claim they are sufficiently clear.

Of course, as always, to get an unbiased decision, you have to stand your ground and take them to the adjudicators.  You're only at the informal reps stage at the moment, and councils ruthlessly game the system by refusing 99% of them, knowing most people then cough-up, not wanting to risk the extra dosh. If you want to fight them, you now have to wait for the Notice to Owner and submit reps again, this time formal. At his stage they may fold because at NtO stage the discount has gone, so they know you are serious about the matter.

It's really all about your attitude to risking money. If you've got investments you're already risking money !
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Re: Code 01 parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours - faded double yellows
« Reply #6 on: »
@Lau1234 absolutely, if you're willing to carry on I'm happy to represent you at the Traffic Penalty Tribunal.

For reference, here is The City Council of Liverpool (North - Part 1 Stationary Vehicle Offences) (Consolidation) Order, 2006.
« Last Edit: December 08, 2023, 07:04:29 pm by cp8759 »
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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
Re: Code 01 parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours - faded double yellows
« Reply #7 on: »

If I now wait for the nto and do a formal appeal etc, do I stand any chance of winning?

Where? You* have to negotiate the NTO/formal reps procedure first, only then would the issue of appealing to an adjudicator apply.

*- are you the registered keeper with current DVLA details?
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Re: Code 01 parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours - faded double yellows
« Reply #8 on: »
Thanks again for all replies. Yes I'm the registered keeper. I am going to carry on and do formal reps, just waiting for the nto now.

@cp8759 thank you so much!
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Re: Code 01 parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours - faded double yellows
« Reply #9 on: »
Morning all

I have received the NTO now (attached). When I do the formal reps, do I just repeat exactly what I said in the informal challenge?

Thanks

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Re: Code 01 parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours - faded double yellows
« Reply #10 on: »
@Lau1234 please confirm whether you've made representations or not.

If not, I think we can come up with something more watertight.
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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
Re: Code 01 parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours - faded double yellows
« Reply #11 on: »
Hello, no I've not done them yet, I think I have until Wednesday to submit them.
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Re: Code 01 parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours - faded double yellows
« Reply #12 on: »
For some reason I thought you'd taken some photos of your own, but actually the photos above are the CEO's photos.

In the circumstances, just make the same representation again.

Don't forget to get a screenshot of the confirmation page.
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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
Re: Code 01 parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours - faded double yellows
« Reply #13 on: »
Hi, so I made the formal representations and I received a letter yesterday to say the pcn has been cancelled. Thank you for all comments and thank you very much to @cp8759 for your help/advice  :)
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Re: Code 01 parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours - faded double yellows
« Reply #14 on: »
Could you post the letter on here please?
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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
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