Author Topic: Bradford CAZ PCN - any grounds for appeal ?  (Read 1822 times)

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Bradford CAZ PCN - any grounds for appeal ?
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Without at this stage submitting documentation, I got a PCN for allegedly infringing Bradford's CAZ - clear picture of the vehicle and front registration plate, clear location, date/time of the picture appear to be correct.

I've checked the PCN spreadsheet for Bradford - no known weaknesses in appeal, so wanted to check before I paid the £60 + £9.

Date of delivery is noted as 2 days after date of posting, the phone number given is 0345 ... - any other procedural improprieties I could potentially use ?

Does anyone have knowledge of the signage / issues there which may help?  Does that depend on the route taken through the CAZ, i.e. a sign missing if joining from a side road may invalidate the PCN?

Also, checking the location given against the map it seems the boundary there covers the whole road, doesn't split it down the middle - so presumably no grounds for driving one way and not the other along the particular road?

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Re: Bradford CAZ PCN - any grounds for appeal ?
« Reply #1 on: »
Have a look at Bristol CAZ cases. There is an argument that adding the toll to the penalty charge is unlawful because the overarching regulations do not allow this.

Technically the toll is still due but they can't make you pay it this way.

All Bristol cases challenged in this way have not actually got to tribunal.

But you will have rhe full penalty of £120 at risk.

Do not miss deadlines.

There may be other issurs with the unseen notice too.

Re: Bradford CAZ PCN - any grounds for appeal ?
« Reply #2 on: »
Like Bristol, (and also Bath), the PCN is unlawful because it is asking for more than the penalty demanded by law. Birmingham and the London ULEZ PCNs are compliant. The Order for Birmingham specifically states that payment of the PCN discharges liability for the toll fee

There are no powers in Regulation 7 of the road user charging regulation that allow them to claim the toll fee as well as the penalty.  This was also ruled by an case in 2018 at the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for a DART PCN, (same regulations).

Anyway, have a read of the regulations (Reg 7) and also the file attached

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2013/1783/regulation/7/made




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Re: Bradford CAZ PCN - any grounds for appeal ?
« Reply #3 on: »
So a form of words challenging it as a procedural impropriety, in that there are no powers under the relevant legislation and regulations to charge a penalty as well as the original CAZ charge?

Using wording from the PDF provided above similar to "There is no power in Regulation 7 for the PCN to require the road user charge to be paid in addition to the penalty charge. Nor is there a power for the charging authority to refuse to allocate a payment made for a charge and hold it, possibly indefinitely, for future use."

Or do I need to be more watertight than that ?

Re: Bradford CAZ PCN - any grounds for appeal ?
« Reply #4 on: »
Quote
So a form of words challenging it as a procedural impropriety, in that there are no powers under the relevant legislation and regulations to charge a penalty as well as the original CAZ charge?
No not quite correct; there are no powers to demand the CAZ charge on the PCN, only the Penalty Charge.

All you need to do submit is a simple and short representation.

This should state that the regulations that apply to the Bradford CAZ are The Road User Charging Schemes (Penalty Charges, Adjudication and Enforcement) (England) Regulations 2013. You have been independently advised that the PCN is unlawful because there are no powers within the above regulations for the CAZ charge to be demanded in the Penalty Charge Notice, only the penalty charge can be demanded. This is confirmed by the Traffic Penalty Tribunal Case Number IA01249-1803 Decision dated 13/06/2018, Ajudicator Caroline Sheppard.

In her decision, she stated, (inter alia) that " There is no power in Regulation 7 for the PCN to require the road user charge to be paid in addition to the penalty charge."

Therefore demanding payment of the CAZ charge as well as the Penalty Charge is a procedural impropriety and the PCN must be cancelled forthwith.

What I suspect they will do is ask you to just pay the CAZ fee as they seem desperate to avoid the matter getting to the TPT. I wonder why !!!
« Last Edit: April 11, 2024, 10:22:31 pm by Incandescent »

Re: Bradford CAZ PCN - any grounds for appeal ?
« Reply #5 on: »
Great, thanks.  I'll appeal the PCN directly in the first instance and let you all know what the outcome is.
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Re: Bradford CAZ PCN - any grounds for appeal ?
« Reply #6 on: »
I've had my appeal rejected - apparently the regs *do* allow councils to decide whether to charge both the penalty and the PCN.

Suggestions?  Or is this the end of the road?

RUCS Regs article 4 - https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2013/1783/part/2/made

Link to Bradford CAZ Charging Order - https://www.bradford.gov.uk/media/7229/bradfordcleanairzonechargingorder2022.pdf

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« Last Edit: May 15, 2024, 08:45:06 am by BeemerDriver »

Re: Bradford CAZ PCN - any grounds for appeal ?
« Reply #7 on: »
Yes, they are entitled to charge the toll and the penalty. But that doesn't help them.

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2013/1783/regulation/7/made

The regulation above determines what may appear on a PCN.

Can you find anything therein which allows it to be added? Thus if they still want the toll they need to give you a different method to pay it.

But, it has yet to be tested for any CAZ and will be at the full prnalty.


Re: Bradford CAZ PCN - any grounds for appeal ?
« Reply #8 on: »
Ok - so one piece of the legislation says they can decide whether to charge the penalty + PCN charge, and another says the PCN can only contain a penalty.

So Bradford's view is different and says they can charge both on the PCN, but the view here is that the PCN can only charge the penalty and there needs to be a separate mechanism to collect the outstanding CAZ charge?

And if so, I'd be a guinea pig?

Re: Bradford CAZ PCN - any grounds for appeal ?
« Reply #9 on: »
Ok - so one piece of the legislation says they can decide whether to charge the penalty + PCN charge, and another says the PCN can only contain a penalty.

So Bradford's view is different and says they can charge both on the PCN, but the view here is that the PCN can only charge the penalty and there needs to be a separate mechanism to collect the outstanding CAZ charge?

And if so, I'd be a guinea pig?
Well, no, as the matter was decided at the TPT in 2018. Read the file I have attached. DART operate under the same road user charging regulations as Bradford. The key sentence in the adjudication is, "There is no power in Regulation 7 for the PCN to require the road user charge to be paid in addition to the penalty charge".

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« Last Edit: May 15, 2024, 10:25:40 am by Incandescent »

Re: Bradford CAZ PCN - any grounds for appeal ?
« Reply #10 on: »
Ok then - so Bradford are wrong, even though they say their scheme was post 2018 and therefore the DART decision doesn't apply.

If I apply to the tribunal there's a very good chance of winning on appeal, is what I'm interpreting this to mean?

Re: Bradford CAZ PCN - any grounds for appeal ?
« Reply #11 on: »
They're talking tosh, because the regulations are the same now as they were in 2018

Re: Bradford CAZ PCN - any grounds for appeal ?
« Reply #12 on: »
The dart decision does not apply in as much as decisions don't set real precedents. An adjudicator could come to a different decision.

It is your money of course. It is, perhaps, curious that there is no known case of Bristol going to tribunal where this narrow point has been raised.

So far (in all probability) nobody related to Bradford enforcement who has any real understanding of the regulations has looked at it to recognise the issue.

It is perhaps somewhat odd that the regulations allow for the charge to be payable (*) in addition to the penalty yet the mechanism of issuing a penalty does not allow it to be demanded as part of the penalty.

Birmingham and TFL may have produced their charging orders - which do not include the toll - having undertaken a more thorough review of what they were implementing with respect to the overarching regulations.

(*) There is a potential issue with that. The bristol order only allows the toll to be paid x days before or y days after.




Re: Bradford CAZ PCN - any grounds for appeal ?
« Reply #13 on: »
So part 2 says "whether a penalty charge ... is payable in addition to the road user charge or instead of such charge" and part 3 reg 7 only mentions "penalty charge".

So it's a matter of interpretation of the fine detail then?  Dart decided one way, and the difference there is that the road user paid the charge albeit a day late.

If the tribunal goes strictly by the letter of the regs, then the PCN would seem to be "an impropriety" unless "penalty" is defined as including the original charge?
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Re: Bradford CAZ PCN - any grounds for appeal ?
« Reply #14 on: »
As far as my simplistic view goes the "unless" doesn't kick in.

However, cautionary, well drafted appeal will be needed.