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The Yellow Box Guru meets The Greek Doctor. Bus Lane advice for London tickets.

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#1
https://www.tiktok.com/@yellowboxguru/video/7659812800281333014?_r=1&_t=ZN-97tT0cVrEJy

Beautiful legislation. If only it applied to all PCNs issued by a camera, it would bring down the system!

A petiiton was started two years ago. If anyone wants to resuurect it, please do.

Para. 7 (6) in particular: 

Most recent win: 

Last Edit: August 08, 2026, 06:42:16 pm by Hippocrates
@Incandescent!

I AM ABLE TO TAKE ON MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. I HATE RETIREMENT.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
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#2
@Incandescent!

I AM ABLE TO TAKE ON MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. I HATE RETIREMENT.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
#3
Hearing tomorrow at 12.30 hrs. Capital Hire Management. Suggest observation as it is a review of a very fine point of law.


http://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/observation-of-hearings/msg129660/#msg129660

Their application of this for a review:

Last Edit: September 07, 2026, 10:11:48 pm by Hippocrates
@Incandescent!

I AM ABLE TO TAKE ON MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. I HATE RETIREMENT.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
#4
This legislation cited appears to have been lifted wholesale from s. 20(8 ) Road traffic Offenders Act 1988. This was the subject of an appeal to the Divisional Court by the DPP in DPP v Thornley [2006] EWHC 312 (Admin)

In Thornley the inferior court found that failure to disclose the certificate 7 days in advance rendered the evidence, given by the operator as a live witness inadmissible, but the Divisional Court held that ss(8 ) only negated admissibility under s. 20(1) or (6) and did not preclude the evidence being given in the normal way (by a live witness under oath or affirmation.

As an aside, Owen J royally laid into the DPP's counsel for not doing his homework before presenting what the DPP's arguments should have been himself - the applicability of the same identical provision in a drink driving case.

The fact that the authorised representative required the attendance of the witness and the witness CBA to turn up, suggests that in this case there was no alternative admissibility.
I am responsible for the accuracy of the information I post, not your ability to comprehend it.
#5
This case is a bit more complicated.
@Incandescent!

I AM ABLE TO TAKE ON MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. I HATE RETIREMENT.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
#7
Is or was? The hearing was 10 hours ago.

Is as it has not been decided yet as we virtually speak. I am staying up.

I have to be careful what I say as I am watched - always have been. Bearded or not.  ::)

I luvs you Andy and owe you a drink after the TFL hearing de briefing in the pub.  ;D

I refer to Transport for London, R (on the application of) v London Tribunals (Environment and Traffic Adjudicators) [2023] EWHC 2889 (Admin) by Swift J.


Just given you a Karma plus. How to bribe a moderator.  8)
Last Edit: September 09, 2026, 12:14:13 am by Hippocrates
@Incandescent!

I AM ABLE TO TAKE ON MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. I HATE RETIREMENT.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
#8
ETA Register of Appeals
Register kept under Regulation 20 of the Road Traffic (Parking Adjudicators) (London) Regulations 1993, as amended and Regulation 17 of the Civil Enforcement of Road Traffic Contraventions (Representations and Appeals) (England) Regulations 2022.
Case Details
Case reference   2260217373
Appellant   Capital Hire Management Ltd
Authority   London Borough of Southwark
VRM   LM73WYG
PCN Details
PCN   JK17768201
Contravention date   04 Dec 2025
Contravention time   16:59:00
Contravention location   CHAMPION PARK (WESTBOUND) TOWARDS DENMARK HILL
Penalty amount   GBP 160.00
Contravention   Being in a bus lane
Referral date   -
Decision Date   05 Aug 2026
Adjudicator   Cordelia Fantinic
Appeal decision   Appeal allowed
Direction   
cancel the Penalty Charge Notice.

Reasons   
Mr Phillip Morgan attended as authorised representative for the Appellant Company. The Authority had been expected to attend, but then sent a message this morning stating that it would not be attending.


Mr Morgan submitted that the Authority's evidence should not be admissible as, on 17 July 2026, he had requested attendance of the Authority at the hearing. A copy of this email is before me. Mr Morgan invoked paragraph 7(6) of Schedule 1 of the London Local Authorities Act 1996, which states:


“Nothing in sub-paragraph (1) or (4) above makes a document admissible as evidence in proceedings under paragraph 6 above unless a copy of it has not less than 7 days before the hearing, been served on the appellant; and nothing in those paragraphs makes a document admissible as evidence of anything other than the matters shown on a record produced by a prescribed device if that person, not less than three days before the hearing or within such further time as the traffic adjudicator may in special circumstances allow, serves a notice on the council requiring attendance at the hearing or trial of the person who signed the document.”


I accept that Mr Morgan, as authorised representative for the Appellant served notice on the Authority requiring its officer's attendance at the hearing. The Authority has not attended. Therefore the evidence of the approved device is not admissible and this contravention has not been proved.


Accordingly the appeal is allowed.
Decision Date   08 Sep 2026
Adjudicator   Mackenzie Robinson
Previous decision   Appeal allowed
Appeal decision   Appeal allowed
Direction   
cancel the Penalty Charge Notice.

Reasons   
This is an application by the enforcement authority to review the original Adjudicator’s decision. This is on the basis that the appellant’s representative did not specifically require the attendance of the person who signed the document, but rather ‘an officer’ of the authority. The authority argues that ‘Paragraph 7(6) of Schedule 1 to the London Local Authorities Act 1996 provides that documentary evidence ceases to be admissible only where the appellant serves notice requiring the attendance of "the person who signed the document" relied upon by the Authority. The statutory requirement is specific. The legislation does not provide that evidence becomes inadmissible merely because an officer of the Authority has been requested to attend and does not do so.’
Mr Morgan, the appellant’s representative, responds firstly on the basis that if it is possible that an adjudicator has made an error of law, the remedy is judicial review of the decision in the High Court, not an application for review of the decision by another adjudicator. More specifically, he also points out that there was no statement in the evidence producing the CCTV evidence, confirming that the evidence came from a type of camera authorised by the Secretary of State. There is only the general authorization for the authority to use a particular type of camera for enforcement purposes.
When he therefore required the attendance of an officer, he was in effect saying ‘if there is such a statement in existence, it will not be accepted in evidence unless the officer who signed the statement attends the hearing, in accordance with Paragraph 7(6) of Schedule 1 to the London Local Authorities Act 1996’.
The parties were therefore somewhat arguing at cross purposes, with the authority maintaining that the appellant had not requested the person who actually signed the statement, whereas the appellant was really pointing out that no such statement have been submitted in evidence. An appellant can hardly be expected to name the person required to attend, if that person has never been identified in a served statement.
It would have been helpful had the appellant’s representative originally made clear that the CCTV evidence was not acceptable in the absence of a statement producing it, and that such a statement, if served in due course, would itself not be accepted unless the person signing the statement joins the hearing at produce it and answer any questions that might be relevant. The adjudicator making the original decision would then have been likely to accurately state that CCTV evidence was inadmissible on the basis that no statement had been served producing the evidence.
I therefore find that the original adjudicator correctly decided that the CCTV evidence was not admissible, not primarily on the basis that person making the supporting statement had not attended the hearing, but because no such statement appeared in the evidence at all.
For the benefit of the authority, I clarify that in order for CCTV evidence to be properly admissible, evidence of the certification of the type of device used for enforcement purposes by the Secretary of State for transport must be produced, and in addition, a statement from an officer producing the actual recording, and confirming that the recording was made by a type of device so approved.
I can identify no legal grounds for disturbing the overall result of the original Adjudicator’s decision. This application is therefore dismissed.
@Incandescent!

I AM ABLE TO TAKE ON MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. I HATE RETIREMENT.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
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#9
For the benefit of the authority, I clarify that in order for CCTV evidence to be properly admissible, evidence of the certification of the type of device used for enforcement purposes by the Secretary of State for transport must be produced, and in addition, a statement from an officer producing the actual recording, and confirming that the recording was made by a type of device so approved.

Another Pandora's box to be opened.
@Incandescent!

I AM ABLE TO TAKE ON MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. I HATE RETIREMENT.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
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#10
Some adjudicators i.e. when they know I am on the case, do look at the evidence in detail before I open my mouth.

Let us not forget: from 2005 until 2023 so-called VCA certificates were missed. More to follow,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

@cp8759 was the main man. Some other guy vented his spleen via a PAPL I seem to remember.  :D

But, they still get it wrong.

So the quesion must be asked of Southwark and the Tribunal whose adjudicators consider the evidence of both parties, applies the law and makes the decision.

THIS IS BIG.
Last Edit: Today at 03:04:50 am by Hippocrates
@Incandescent!

I AM ABLE TO TAKE ON MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. I HATE RETIREMENT.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
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